Or, Learn Parkour: An ADHD Podcast
Or, Learn Parkour: An ADHD Podcast
OLP 012: It’s-A-Corporeoli!
In this episode of Or, Learn Parkour: Jordan & Lex tackle the age old question, "Does Tony the Tiger have ADHD?" Join us for a dive into the proverbial pool of ADHD representation and watch as we bonk our heads on the bottom. Hydrate up and listen in as we talk about the good, bad, and ugly faces of ADHD in media!
Thanks for listening!
CW/TW: Mental health, ADHD, explicit language, loud noises, yelling, food, cereal, Kellogg, hydroflask noises, rambling, mouth noises, singing, lube mention, sexual content, bleeped swears, mascots
Credits:
Cover art by: Krizia Perito
Theme: There Is A Dark Place
Socials:
Mental Health Resources:
There is a dog.[inaudible]
Speaker 2:Hi, I'm Jordan and I'm Lex, and this is still or learn par core. Welcome back everybody. Yeah. Welcome to a brand new year. That's totally feels super different than the last one. We're off to a great start, but we're here. We are here in 2021. This is our first episode of this year. I feel like we've said the word a year. A lot. Yeah. But then if you had said 2021, you would have just said it twice in one sentence and see really million, one of 2021. This is 2021. How many years were in last year though? So that's not actually an unreasonable marker of time. Sure. Yeah. Anyways, welcome back. This is a new year, but the same ADHD podcast that you know and love maybe. Well, I don't want to presume your feelings that, you know, exists, that you exist in the same realm as, and, uh, we are glad to have you back with us. We're assuming you are. If you're listening to this. Yeah. We're two adult people, humans, most probably anyways, who have ADHD and still do. Yeah, we still do. And we really liked to talk about it with each other and on a microphone so that other people can hear our voices in the public sphere. That's uh, what you are experiencing now, this oral cacophony is Jordan's voice and you just started lax, same old. Co-hosts another year older. I speak. Therefore I am podcast. Yep. That's how that goes. I am become podcast. Yeah, we've done. What Descartes Oppenheimer. Is that what who's that? Yeah. Yeah. I can't name any more people. That's just the four of us. Just the four of us. We didn't make any funny. Just me, just me and you just, um, and Oppenheim. Do you want to know how I know that song and how I first heard that song love two legs. It was on an AMV of Naruto. Um, and it was a mashup of lots of different songs. What other songs were in there? What really can stand up to that. Okay. So I'm sure it was called Nara toned. Like, you know what I mean? Like you own someone already winning, uh, it started with Helena by my chemical romance, but then instead of like, cause it was started out super edgy and like dark clearly because that's what a lot of AMVs did at the time. And then they did the light noise that, um, happens in at least in the English dub of nerd. Like when they do the cloning you did too and, or Clooney and you'd see Jitsu G I dunno when he does the clone thing, there's like a boom noise and they do that noise between each song. Great. And then it's like, Oh, this is going to be a funny one. And it is funny. And then there's like a point in the middle where it's fine. We don't need to talk about this anymore. But that's the first time I ever heard that song was in an art
Speaker 3:And continues to be strong with you. That's incredible. That made my entire day. Oh good. And it's 8:50 PM central time right now. So there's been a lot of day to make. So please know the weight of your narrow toe experience and how it's dear is to me.
Speaker 2:Oh Lord. Oh, Oh. Someone helped me. Uh, I always hope, I hope y'all are surviving and hanging in there. Yeah, we are.
Speaker 3:Y'all had some peaceful, restful safe. Huh?
Speaker 2:And if not, that's okay. I just applaud you for surviving, whether it's out of spite or love or just, or a mix of both luck. Yes. Who's to say. Yeah, basically there's, there's a lot happening. We know that we are constantly aware of that. We sure are. But so this, this is, I think our attempt with this episode, at least to me, is to sorta take a beat check out of that sort of reality that we are technically corporally
Speaker 3:Beholden to. Yeah. Whatever.
Speaker 2:Uh what's what's the[inaudible]. Is that a word? Well, cause like it's corporeal. Yeah. So corporeally I think so. [inaudible] why does that sound good?[inaudible] I was about to say, why does that sound like I got a pasta, uh, same brain cell. Yeah. So we're doing a podcast. Yup. Do you want a podcast
Speaker 3:Dipping our toe back in this, a warm pool of audio and uh,
Speaker 2:Starting this. I didn't mean it to be gross. I meant it to be like soothing. Yeah. I think like warm pool, just like imagining like, Oh, so someone just peed next to you in a pool. Unless you're a rich person who had a temperature controlled pool, I was imagining like a bath. It was a small temperature controlled pool. You have a, we can't both fit in a bathtub. That'd be wild. And while recording with this equipment, Jordan, how irresponsible dream bigger.
Speaker 3:Imagine a big old bathtub.
Speaker 2:We're just in like a hamster ball floating steam. Mike is just like rolling around on the bottom of it. And we're like, Oh man. Or like I imagine in that situation, I would just be like lying down as much as you can in a hamster ball and just be like, you good. And then you'd be like flailing. And then I would just be like, cool, I'm going to keep vibing, just trying to chase the mic. And it keeps rolling in front of me. And I'm just like just laying there catatonic. That would be terrible audio. Oh. But now I kind of want it to happen on like video. At least that'll be patriotic about that next on the list. Giant hamster ball. Ooh. Okay. Um, that's
Speaker 3:Gracious. Uh, shall we do a podcast?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we should. Let's do some good old escapism. Let's do it.
Speaker 3:And w what are we podcasting about today,
Speaker 2:Lex escapism? That we're literally doing some good old escapism or good talk about representation and media specifically in relation to ADHD. Heck yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3:We are not going to do an explanation of representation because much smarter people have talked about that, but we do have some characters who are ADHD. We're going to talk about. And some characters who we would like to be ADHD or think are ADHD.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. And I think we'll probably also kind of touch on like the types yeah. The stereotypes that are perpetuated by representation, the blessing and the curse of that, for sure. Yes. And also should be noted when doing research for this episode, apparently representation in media in a scholarly way often means people writing stuff about it and like the news and all that kind of stuff, and like fancy highbrow people doing like op-eds on how Adderall is gonna kill the brains of the youth because it's overdiagnosed. And then the only other articles and think pieces are talking about the people who are being about ADHD and it really was a rabbit hole. So then was zoomed back out, took a different sort of tack to pop back
Speaker 3:For a second though. I just want to say to all of those people. Okay. I understand if you're worried about giving kids Adderall when they don't need it.
Speaker 2:Trust me. You'll know.
Speaker 3:It's not like you're going to be like months into an Adderall prescription and be like, Hmm.
Speaker 2:Hm. Is
Speaker 3:This harming my child? Like you'll know if they don't need Adderall
Speaker 2:Basically. Yeah. So chill. Yeah. Well, and I think it also just really takes all of the nuance out of medication and treatment in general. Right. And especially when it comes to children who have their own thoughts and feelings, but are also directly under like the power of parents and teachers and they have expectations and thoughts. And so it is just wild to me that there's people who are like, I know there's several people involved in this decision-making but there's too much
Speaker 3:If it happened in anyways, I don't know any of you. So here's the decision I'm going to make for you. Yeah. Basically anyways, that's not what we're here to talk about. Yeah. But we're keeping the brand strong by getting off track.
Speaker 2:Yes. And also keeping the brand strong. I would argue by just dunking on people we've never met. Oh yeah. It's kind of a, kind of a specialty I would say of mine. I know you are exquisite at it. My dear. Thank you. Sometimes I look at people like say like Chelsea Peretti and I'm like, Hmm. Interesting. In what sense? In the sense of like mood yeah. Like that I am exquisite and I am correct about everything sort of energy. You know what I mean? Yeah. But also a little just like, and so I am, but a small, beautifully groomed dog on a velvet day bed who is being fed treats and being pet. I love
Speaker 3:That journey for you. I really, really do. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I lost the plot there a little bit, but
Speaker 3:I think we ended up somewhere really beautiful. Thank you. The whole time. I was just thinking about Richard Dreyfuss, hunkered over you think dog food. So I kind of couldn't help you there. Cool.
Speaker 2:Well, I was thinking about in, um, Oliver and company, the animated version of all over yeah. All over, but with cats, well, a cat and then a bunch of dogs. Right. But there's the one dog who she's like the rich person's own or owner, basically that seems like the Democrats work. Well, she's not a cat though. Right. And it's the rich person's dog and it's more like she doesn't own the person, not the other way round. It really does seem that way. But she like has a big circular like room and it has like a spiral staircase. And it's like this whole like, like she's almost looks like she's like a hotel heiress, which is a dog. And then her whole musical number is her like putting like eye shadow on
Speaker 3:Just like living the London Tipton dream. Yeah.
Speaker 2:A little bit. And like, she's kind of a Dick and I do appreciate that. But, um, question for you, what's up,
Speaker 3:You know how it's been a thing lately to like turn Disney movies into Broadway.
Speaker 2:Okay. Yeah, sure. Yeah. Arrest to cats, the musical yay or nay. I think the similarities to the of cats is too close. I don't think anyone can do any sort of like cat adjacent musical for at least another couple millennia. That's fair.
Speaker 3:That's fair. Not like we need more Disney musicals in the season. That's what's definitely what Broadway needs now.
Speaker 2:Okay. But how are you, how are you doing over there? Run. Great. Okay. Cool. Tony, the tiger. Great. Okay. Sorry. Cool. I'm good. I'm good. Cool. Cool. Cool, cool, cool. Cool. Do you think Tony, the tiger has ADHD? Uh, I don't know, but I do know that I saw giant, uh, Tony, the tiger mascot because I grew up in Southwest Michigan, your Kellogg. So of course, you know, when you're a little, you go on like field trips and such to the Kellogg cereal factory stuff. And there was a Tony, the tiger person and a big Tony, the tiger mascot costume. And I don't really remember if I was scared or not, but I do remember in my recollection of it currently, I'm like, Hmm. You know? So I hope that if he has ADHD, he's getting, you know, whatever treatment he needs for it. But like, otherwise I'd rather not speculate about Tony. The tiger. That's fair. Now I say it like, it just felt like he just seemed like gross.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Just like the general mascot aura,
Speaker 2:Anything against Tony, the tiger, his character. It's just like the only concrete experience I have with Tony. The tiger besides eating frosted flakes. Yeah. Is a Tony, the tiger mascot. Sure, sure. Does that make sense? Hopefully we kind of got to the heart of it.
Speaker 3:Yeah. No, that absolutely makes sense. That absolutely tracks. And I understand just kind of the deep seated mistrust of mascots.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I don't know. I mean, and if he does have ADHD, I think that he's probably probably in a good line of work. Yeah. Well, and also just like
Speaker 3:Doing really well, just helping
Speaker 2:Kids to have a stable, steady job that he actually likes,
Speaker 3:Like interact with a lot of people and it's very exuberant and uses that energy gels it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. No. And like, there's that one jingle, there's a jingle, you know, like, Hey Tony, I don't know that. I realized as soon as I that's all I remember of it. And I was like, I can't camp before
Speaker 3:Bursting more of that. Kellogg's you got to pay us for
Speaker 2:First. Just the Hey Tony and dead silence for like two seconds. Whoa. I hate the audio medium. Hey, Hey Tony, Tony, answer me. Tony. Are you okay? Are you okay? Are
Speaker 4:You okay, Tony? Tony? Are you okay? Or are you okay? You okay, Tony?[inaudible] a smooth[inaudible]
Speaker 2:That are not done. That are not great.[inaudible]
Speaker 4:Kellogg
Speaker 2:Getting the check and uh, four to six business days. Yeah. So welcome. Come on Michigan. I know, I know that like the main celebrity we have is Tim Allen. We can do better. Helped me get there with Tony. The tiger. The musical. Oh, featuring it's
Speaker 4:My Michael Jackson jukebox musical. Oh no. What a bad idea on all fronts. Like everyone's like
Speaker 2:What sort of stereotypes and bad ideas do you have about like, you know, dudes who may or may not have, you know, and then it's like, Oh, mascots check, uh, celebrities that have had some questionable life choices and some documentaries made about them. Chick.
Speaker 4:I think I'd still
Speaker 2:Prefer that to theorist, to cats, musical, even if it's just to watch it crash and burn. Yeah. I'm imagining sort of like the Spider-Man musical with Adam.
Speaker 4:Can we, can we put radioactive back co-written prior match, wholehearted production company,
Speaker 2:That old Kellogg, the one who, uh, Graham crackers. I think, you know, it's that whole thing. The seventh day Adventists. They like, they're like corn flakes. You're not being horny. Yeah.
Speaker 4:Up who's to say legacy[inaudible]
Speaker 2:Washington. Oh God.
Speaker 3:Now we're getting into like Mr. Burns of post electric plate there at Tory. And this is
Speaker 2:Does too much. Oh boy. Uh, the phone lines are open producers.
Speaker 3:Wait, this idea is going to go quick. I'm see you. Next season
Speaker 2:Casting part of the contract, we all have
Speaker 3:Are like posts, show circle, holding hands, like passing the squeeze. And except for that, it's still like passing around a box of frosted flakes.
Speaker 2:Sorry. I'm just imagining like, you know how directors really liked to make their stage manager and lives super hard. I'm just imagining that there's just every show ends with some sort of like mountain of frosted flakes getting dumped onto the stage directed you already produce off. Oh, but you know what I mean, though? Like you just have the super tired crew just with the giant room. Like just sweeping them into garbage bags where they're going to be taken and used again for every show for like corn flakes.
Speaker 3:But you know, the people and the cats are probably just like eating handfuls of them anyways.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Because they don't understand what hygiene is in the crews. Just like, I'm not going to tell them. They're kind of gets to the point where you just don't care. You're just like[inaudible] anyways, that's valid. Um, I, who, so representation, I don't know if Tony the tiger has or does not have ADHD. Okay. Well, so he's on the maybe list.
Speaker 3:Some questions are, are better on answered, I suppose, for now, for now, who is ADHD though? Do you want to talk?
Speaker 2:I would love to tell you about characters that canonically have ADHD. I'm all ears. We got to characters like Barney from how I met your mother, Tracy from 30 rock styles from teen Wolf. Hey, Seuss from the fosters Phil from modern family, Bart from the Simpsons junior, guff from Juneau. Nice. Alan from the hangover, gingerbread in life is funny. Most of the half bloods in the Percy Jackson series. Uh, and there's a couple more. Okay. But canonical ADHD is a short enough that I can read a list down the podcast basically. Yeah. That's not a lot. And uh,
Speaker 3:I do see a theme where it seems like the majority of those characters are male.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yep. Or like masculine coded and coded men, men coded men coded. Why does this code in new code admin? I don't[inaudible] queen Amman. Marybeth delicious. So yeah. Uh, yeah. Yeah. A lot of this is pretty rough. Um, did you want me to touch on some characters that are not canonically ADHD, but sort of people often say they're coded to have ADHD.
Speaker 3:Sure. And then we can get into like what coded means and yeah. Makes up that representation, but lay it on me.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. We can talk about like what, what we mean by like coded with ADHD specifically, but also, I mean, one thing that I would be curious to talk about with you is like the sort of types of characters that these seem to fall into. Um, so, uh, but some of the more notable ADHD coded or ADHD, stereotypical sort of characters that, um, and this isn't just Jordan and I being like, we think this it's it's characters that people have talked about. Yes. Seeming like they have ADHD, but we don't have necessarily a canonical. Like they were diagnosed with ADHD and like community source. Yes, yes, yes. For once
Speaker 3:It's not just us going off the sheets
Speaker 2:For once for now. Emma Woodhouse from Emma, by Jane Austin. Uh, Helen Burns from Jane Eyre by Charlotte Bronte, Tom Sawyer, fidgety. Phil who taught her. Yep. Um, and Shirley, uh, Anne Shirley is from Anne of green Gables. Ah, the titular am and from Anne of green Gables, which that tracks to me, uh, Maria, from the sound of music, classic Scarlet O'Hara from gone with the wind, uh, and apparently King Henry the eighth. All right. Okay.
Speaker 3:Yeah. That one I did not see coming. Admittedly.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's super fair. Uh, some other ones too are like Doug, the dog, literally go squirrel that one. Yeah. Great. A plus representation or, uh, Daniel Hillard and Mrs. Doubtfire. That's Robin Williams' character. Dory from finding Nemo is another one. Okay. Hiccup from how to train your dragon. Yeah. And Maria Von Trapp. That sort of music. Oh, yup.
Speaker 3:That's okay. She's great. There's a whole song about how much that makes sense at the beginning of that musical.
Speaker 2:Yes. How do you catch a cloud and pin it down? Yes. Line they reference so, so there you have it, that's it episode done? I do have a question. Oh, you have a question.
Speaker 3:So if Emma from Emma possibly has ADHD, would that mean by extension that Cher in clueless has ADHD because it's based on Emma and she's the Emma character.
Speaker 2:I mean, that sounds like a good head Canon to me. Hell yeah. I haven't seen clueless in a while, but I have seen it a few times. Didn't
Speaker 3:We watch clueless like a month ago.
Speaker 2:No, what we did not watch
Speaker 3:Clueless. Oh my God. I watched clueless with Bay lamps.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry. No, it's okay. I was like, I, I love you. We watched tonight at the Roxbury recently learning experience for sure. It sure did not hold up what it also did still make me laugh real hard. It's an experience there's so much that is genuinely so funny. And so much of it that it's like, Oh wow, I'm going to,
Speaker 3:I'm going to claim that though. I'm going to say Cher from clueless. Yep. I see it. I feel it. I feel seen by it. Yeah. And I wish I was heard. Sometimes
Speaker 2:We also had a Dora
Speaker 3:From Shira Adora. Yes. Head cannoned ADHD,
Speaker 2:I suppose. Yeah. A Dora is sort of head Canon, but also sort of technically cannon because a lot of, uh, Dora's personality and behavioral stuff was apparently taken from a lot of Noel Stevenson's sort of life experience as the writer. And she has come out and said that she thinks that Dora has ADHD cause she has ADHD. Right. Um, and she wrote a lot of those sort of behavior and personality traits that we see a lot with ADHD, but there's no like, you know, when you're watching Shira. Yeah. There's no canonical sort of existence of ADHD. I don't think. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, that's a one that I've noticed a lot in some of these like head canons is like, we recognize those symptoms. But a lot of them, I don't want to pin this as like an excuse, but just contextually like a Dora like Emma, like Helen Burns from Jane Eyre, like Korra from legend of Korra like they're not in systems where there was a term for that. You know, some of these are, you know, fantastical.
Speaker 2:You mean that the avatar isn't clinically diagnosed with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.
Speaker 3:Oh, I don't remember an episode where the avatar goes to therapy.
Speaker 2:Wow. Cora really should have though. I wish that I could have gotten to therapy. She really did.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I don't think that the DSM exists in the avatar universe.
Speaker 2:That's probably a good though. Well, I'm not going to critique the DSM. We all do that enough. Just know that I am judging and critiquing the DSM in my head. Yep. Yep. For everyone
Speaker 3:Listening to this in their earbuds, as someone who is sitting directly across from Lex, I can feel the judgment. It is palpable. It is real,
Speaker 2:But it's not meant for you. So just kind of like your, your yes. And I'm just perceiving it. Yeah, no I'm just bearing witness. Yeah. No, there's, there's a shield. You are, but a essential worker behind a plastic shield and I am a no. Okay. White woman just existing. Huh?
Speaker 3:Well, I think in that, I think if that were the true comparison, I would be hurt a lot more by your waves of judgment because it would be grocery store PPE. Doesn't do
Speaker 2:I, I said, we're going to take us out of this reality. We're stuck in, but apparently it's just deep in there.
Speaker 3:Um, I'll just say, I am, I'm like the midwife to these feelings coming out of you. They're not mine that's they don't
Speaker 2:Affect me not worse, but it, it felt what it felt like a lot. I took some psychological damage. Let's just accept that.
Speaker 3:There's not a good metaphor for this and uh,
Speaker 2:Move on. Yeah. Okay. It seems like the best way to handle this. All right. So just
Speaker 3:Media, am I right? Um, yeah. So, I mean, let's talk about
Speaker 2:So coding, right? Yes. I know that there's a lot of talk about like code switching and characters being coded, or like coded with various types of personality traits, uh, coded with different sorts of like ethnicities and race. Like there's lots of different ways to code identities in the writing process of, you know, the people who are creating media with fictional characters. Right. Right. So
Speaker 3:What does that mean then? Coning
Speaker 2:At least is how I understand it is sort of like the subtext of the characters, behavior, identity, personality. What have you? Um, so it's, it's something that's not explicitly stated canonically but you can tell and it's purposeful on the end of the writer. Right, right, right. That makes sense. And so I think that part of that, right. Cause some of it is like coded with ADHD and some of it is like, like Emma's not coded with ADHD because I doubt that Jane Austin was sitting there and like, how can I weave this subtext in here so that my protagonist is showing clear signs of like hysteria or whatever the they called it. Probably. Um, you know what I mean? Yeah. I, I guess like we are sort of using that term sort of loosely, I think when it comes to ADHD, but I feel like people will hear it the most often with coding. Right. Cause there have been so many fictional where they weren't allowed to canonically state within a TV show or a play or movie or anything. Right. Like they couldn't explicitly show or state that character was. Right. So they would add like subtextual sort of clues or write them in a way where like the intention was sort of there the whole time. Right. They couldn't explicitly call it out. So there is a little bit of a difference there in that like, you know, different types of oppression, I guess that, you know, cause obviously people with mental health, uh, what, what basically anyone who doesn't have a neuro-typical totally quote unquote normal brain, there's a lot of historical oppression that has happened from people who don't think the way that others do. So, and that's not, I don't mean like free speech. Like they don't behave the way, you know, you know what I mean? Like, I mean like when our brain chemistry works differently yes. That history and the world, we're not like people historically weren't always kind,
Speaker 3:Yeah. The system was not built for those ways. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yes. And uh, still, you know, we still deal with a lot of that stuff now, but I don't want to like try and compare it to like being oppressed as a person. Cause that's like a, it's like apples and oranges almost straight. So yeah. I guess that's like, I'm, this is a really roundabout way of saying it, but which just basically like, when we talk about coded as ADHD, I think we're talking about like characters that aren't canonically ADHD, but either they were written in such a way that like we recognize those symptoms, right. Either
Speaker 3:Intentionally or unintentionally, or would you say something mean quote, unquote coded has to be with intent from the author.
Speaker 2:So that's the thing, right? It's like they talk about, it has to be intentional right. In that, in the subtext it's put in there. But when you think of like something like ADHD, it's not like Jane Austin was thinking about Emma having ADHD, right. Like Emma was flighty, rambunctious and impulsive and had very strong emotional reactions. And you know, so all of these things that like her intention was to describe Emma as this quote unquote type of girl. Right. Which is a whole thing with this piece of media, I feel like some interesting characteristics, at least I noticed between that sort of ADHD character type. That's a younger woman, usually white, but not always, but usually white, you know, media. Yeah. You know, so usually young fem presenting character who is separate from other young women. Right. And sometimes that type is almost put forward in a way of like young girls who act like boys. Um, and I think that's a really interesting tie, like an interesting sort of connection to look at and also like how that sometimes kind of ties to the idea of like the manic pixie dream girl. Right, right, right. Um, not super directly, but do you know what I mean? Like someone who's different and special and yes. Has these flaws that are also her strengths and like there's a lot of, there's a lot to unpack there. Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:And I mean, even going back to that idea of like girls who, who behave more like boys, that's, that's a representation challenge because that's not the predominant way that ADHD presents in women.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yes. So yeah, I guess yeah. A lot of these examples. Aren't great.
Speaker 3:Yeah. No, I think that that's kind of what this boils down to is. There's not, there's not ton of representation. There's not quantitatively a lot and there's not qualitatively
Speaker 2:A lot. Yeah. Yup. And then I think it's interesting that like one of the lists that I sort of found right. Was like characters that people think are ADHD coded, right. Or like Dory from finding Nemo. And it's like, she's a fish who has an issue with remembering things. Cause she's a fish like, so I think there's some level like, and then Doug, the dog who is a dog, who's a D yeah. I think there's like some interesting, yeah.
Speaker 3:Anthropomorphized, any dog they'd have ADHD. Sure. I would argue maybe not. Yeah.
Speaker 2:All of them, but like a good chunk of them still though. Like some of the most pointed too
Speaker 3:Representations of ADHD in popular media is animals who are one dimensional. That's not great. It's not great. That's well, that's one thing that that's where, for example, Helen Burns from Jane Eyre, who we've mentioned before is not, you know, explicitly said to have ADHD because this book was published in 1947. But like one of the things that she says about herself, which honestly to me feels like some of the clearest representation of inattentive ADHD that I've ever seen for context Highland burns was a character in the first part of the book that Jane Eyre as a young girl meets when she is at school and Jane notices that she is getting treated differently by teachers and starts to talk to her about it. And this is a quote from the book, Helen is talking about herself and the way that she learns and she says, I am, as miss sketchpad said, Slattern lane. I seldom put and never keep things in order. I am careless. I forget rules. I read what I should learn my lessons. I have no method. And sometimes I say like you, I cannot bear to be subjected to systematic arrangements. Um, that's totally not relatable. Yeah. Um, but what's so interesting too is it's not said quite as explicitly, but Helen, like I said, gets kind of treated differently and punished by the teachers. And she never kind of stands up for herself the way Jane wants her to. She just takes it very personally. So we even see that element of RSD coming in. And you know, like I said, this book was published in the mid 18 hundreds. So that's not like, you know, Charlotte Bronte was reading the manuals and studying up on these things. But that's such a clear picture that I can't make assumptions, but I would bet that this character was inspired by somebody that Charlotte Bronte knew who would likely be diagnosed with ADHD today. Yeah. So
Speaker 2:That's fair. It's one of those things, right. Where so many people have seen themselves in these characters and seeing their own symptoms and behaviors in these characters. That's like, it's not technically ADHD coded, but at this point it feels like we've sort of imposed that on. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I think your, your guests is probably correct, but also like, can't say for sure, but like, you know what I mean,
Speaker 3:Look at that collection of symptoms and a character, the same way someone would look at a collection of symptoms and a person and say, yeah, that fits this cluster of things that fall under ADHD.
Speaker 2:Honestly, I guess one caveat. And I'm not saying that we're doing this, but like one caveat is just to add that, like these are characters, they're fictional characters. So they're not moral ethical entities. Right. They're, they're not beings, they're just characters in stories. And so like on the one hand, it doesn't matter one way or the other technically right. If, if characters have ADHD or not, but stories mean something. Yeah. And characters mean something because we see ourselves in characters, you know, and I mean, again, we don't need to tell y'all why representation is important, but not seeing yourself represented in a clear way can be really damaging. And so luckily there are these characters, right. That people can point to historically, but there's also characters that you can point to that it's like super insulting and huge bummer that that's like what kids apparently, you know, are exposed to. So whether someone has ADHD or not, they're still going to meet somebody who has ADHD at some point in their lives. Right. And so I do think that representation is really important for empathy. Yeah. We've like people have done tons of studies on that. And again, we don't need to stress how important representation is, but like it is something that, you know,
Speaker 3:Has an effect on us. Like it has a positive effect. I think for people with ADHD to be able to look back at a book from the 18 hundreds, be able to look at Emma, be able to look at people in modern media and say, there are people like me and especially I never read them. I think I missed that boat a little bit. But the Percy Jackson books, I think that's a huge part of the reason that those were popular is because there's explicit ADHD representation and they go to lengths to portrayed as a good positive thing. Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:The whole thing with Percy Jackson is that it's about half bloods. These children literal teenage children who are half human half God. A lot of it has to do with like the Greek gods, but then there's also the Roman versions of those gods. Yeah. No there's spinoff series, not spinoff. There's another second series to the original Percy Jackson series that talks more about and focuses on like the Roman half, half bloods, but they go to camp half-blood and like they live in cabins based on who their godly parent is. Um, I can't believe you didn't read these. I loved these books and like it, yeah. So there's a lot of cool stuff in those books. A lot of really interesting ways to look at Greek and Roman mythology. Uh, Rick Jordan also has a series about like Egyptian mythology. And I know that there are some criticisms of whatever, but there's always criticism of everything all the time. I just don't, I don't have the energy to keep up sometimes, you know, but with, excuse me, with the Percy Jackson series, they all have ADHD or they all have these powers from being Demi gods that they get diagnosed with ADHD in the quote unquote real world. And then later on when they're like old enough or get introduced to it, they go to camp half-blood
Speaker 3:Yeah. I have a quote from, I don't know if this is the book or the movie, but they kind of lay it out as like you're impulsive. He can't sit still in the classroom. That's your battlefield reflexes. Your attention problems are because you see too much, not too little and your senses are better than a mere mortals. So that's a very pointed effort to frame those symptoms as, as other people say, like a superpower. Um, and that's definitely refreshing, especially if you've been in a point in your life where those are causing you harm or people are looking down on you because of those things to see that. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. No, definitely. One of those things that I didn't know, I had ADHD when I was reading those books, but looking back that is such a great, like obviously again, everything's flawed in some way, nothing is perfect. There's no such thing as perfect representation, but it is really cool that there's this cornerstone for like a whole generation of people who can look at those characters and canonically be like, Whoa, you know, and I think that's fantastical sort of comparisons to Demi gods aside. Like it's just really empowering. Yeah. And I think that's really dope. Yeah. I guess I'm sort of curious, cause we've just, we've talked about a lot of different characters. Right. And we've talked about like some good and bad sort of ramifications, right? Like people thinking we're stupid or like just forgetful to a harmful extent. Right. Um, and, and you know, no, one's perfect. Sometimes that does happen. But like again, for that to be the only representation of the, that people have is like a focal point. Right. Like, hello. Yeah. But I am sort of curious to, or not curious, I do want to sort of talk a little bit more about like the different types that we see. Cause we've, we touched on, I think a lot and it's probably is because of who we are as people and like the gender identities that we've grown up with. Right. The young girl who's a little feral kind of like has lots of gumption, you know, but it was also like her head's in the clouds and you know,[inaudible] but like that sort of scale right. Between an attentive combined it into hyperactive. But like, but like, yeah. So you see like the, the range, but it's always like the sort of commonality right. Of like, she doesn't have a lot of friends, but the few friends she does have are really close and they get her and you know, for a lot of the main problems in the stories are caused by her, her flaws. Yeah. But then they're also solved by those same traits that are then turned around to be strengths instead of flaws. And there's this whole sort of arc that this sort of stereotypical girl with what may or may not be ADHD sort of behaves as like you see Anne of green Gables and Shirley it's great example, uh, has a hard time paying attention in class is smart as a whip, sharp as attack, but like super impulsive and talkative daydreamy, but incredibly creative. And we'll just do anything that she decides. Sounds fun. Maybe we'll do it to the fullest extent possible. I know I'm going on this description for awhile. And Shirley is one of those characters that I growing up really identified strongly with my mom and I used to watch everything cables, stature. Gotcha. I think that's another one that I missed out on. I don't think I ever, yeah, it's, it's really sweet. I would recommend it. Um, but again, right. Like that's just that one type and it makes sense that we've been talking about that type. Right. But I think like the other types would be sort of the big one we see in a lot of media, which is the young, primarily white boy. Not always, I've seen some people say that Myles Miralis from spider man into the spider verse or whatever. Um, ha shows some traits of ADHD. And I think that's seems accurate. I haven't seen that movie lately. Like I've seen it probably three times, but it was long time ago. So like, I don't want to just like be like, yeah, but I see it. I see it. Yeah. Yeah. So I've seen some people make that connection, but a lot of the time it is like the young white boy who's hyperactive and has all of the stereotypical quote unquote ADHD behavior
Speaker 3:That very class clown kind of stereotype. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Uh, very seldom. The protagonist often seems to be like the best friend figure for the protagonist. Not always, but like a lot of the time that seems to be the, the sort of focus for like what ADHD looks like and media. And then I feel like the third type is like the subhuman, like the animals, like comparing to animals too. It's like, I, I feel a YALI animals and like one dimensional characters, you know, but primarily like when it's just straight up like characters that aren't even people yeah. There's a lot to unpack there. But then also it makes me think of like basically how people who are ACE or people who are on the spectrum are coded as robots. Totally different reasoning for those two things. But like, those are two communities that are often coded as like literally robotic and human,
Speaker 3:But there's an underlying theme to both of those as like you are lacking something that we, all we I say is like the neuro typicals. Yeah. It's fundamental. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yes. And, um, you're useful. You can be useful, you have skills, you have, you know, things to bring, but it's not complete. Yeah. Um, and I think it's other, yes. So very othering, very, I shouldn't say subhuman, but like the other, the outsider and that also can sometimes show up in the character. Who's a complete loner. Right. Um, we can think about like, Tom Sawyer has a few friends, but like kind of it's off. Yeah. It was on some adventures and with Papa Barry fan or whatever. So thanks grandpa. Yeah. Yeah. But anyways, yeah. So like those were sort of the three categories that I sort of put everything into. Right. Was like the young hyperactive boy, the vaguely feral little girl who's not behaving the way she supposed to.
Speaker 3:Okay. And the email pixie dream girl. Yes.
Speaker 2:Yeah. No, that's what it feels like to me. And then that third category of just like other and not in a D all of the above sort of way, like a literally othering. Yes. And so I guess I would be curious to hear like what you think, or if you think there are other categories, or obviously we can't boil it down to just three. Right. Like, and I'm not like saying this is the definitive end all be all, but, but that tracks,
Speaker 3:And I think that it also, it really illustrates how poor the representation is. Yeah. Because I mean, I can say personally, I, as a human being, don't fall in, in any of those three categories, I don't honestly identify with any of those character types that much, but I'm still ADHD. Yeah. I guess my question would be then,
Speaker 2:And then like what, what characters did you see yourself in when you were growing up? You know, and like, do you think that they looking back at them are sort of coded with those behavioral or neurodivergent traits and behaviors and stuff, or like,
Speaker 3:This is like, I know we started out
Speaker 2:With a lot of goofs, but like, this is actually really genuinely getting into like a real discussion right now. And I'm like, wow, this is so boring. But like at the same time, we're actually talking about things of substance on our podcasts.
Speaker 3:Wild. Hello. Um, I mean, I think a lot of the characters that I identified with were coded probably with other mental health things, just because I have an attempt of type ADHD. So a lot of the characters that, I mean, as you put it, all of the types of human character that you outlined have an impulsive element. And I don't experience that on the same scale. I mean, I, you know, have some impulsivity of like, Oh, I want to do this right now, but not, not in an entertaining sense. No one's going to ride about it. It's okay. I guess I didn't experience it as a defining character trait because of the other things going on in my life and my psyche. So, I mean, I loved chasing Vermeer and the sequels when I was a kid. Um, and I really identified with Petra and I haven't read those books in a while, but she was, I think, smart beyond her age and to some degree impulsive and to some degree, like outside of the way she was expected to act and probably a little bit more impulsive, but more yeah. More of that mental hyperactivity than the physical. Yeah. And again, it's been a long time since I've read that book. So I, you know, see less of myself in characters who I think would be really obvious ADHD representation, but yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean, I mentioned Anne of green Gables. It's pretty classic. And I think there are a lot of people who relate to Anne of green Gables. I think that like, she, she does seem to be a character that resonates with a lot of people. So like, I don't want to say that like you have ADHD if you relate to Ansanelli cause that's wild. So wild diagnostic criteria to throw into the DSM for ya. When I was younger, I think what really stuck with me write about characters like Anne Shirley, like I mentioned, Anne Shirley, but when I think about characters that I really identified with, like, to me, it didn't matter as much about like race or gender or any of those things. Like to me, it was whether a character felt like they were trying their best, but not hitting the Mark, like not fitting in basically. And then oftentimes the stories that would resonate with me the most were the stories of people who had some sort of flaws right. In their like, or perceived flaws in their character and their behavior and their personality. But then it turns out that the reason is because they are part God or magical or from a different planet or, you know, that sort of character that feels othered. It feels like an outsider, but it turns out they're not an outsider, they're just not in the right place. And so I think that had a lot, like a big impact on my psyche of like characters who had these ADHD type personality traits and behaviors that sort of made them a little out of step with the rest of the team. Like they,
Speaker 3:Or perfectly functional, just not for the situation they weren't.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. And then feel that I feel that, but then that, that satisfaction of finding a perfect square for the square hole, you know, like feeling that relief and power, right. How empowering it is when those character arcs get to the point where they begin to like really blossom and grow because they learn how to work with these strengths. Right. That these things that turn out to be strengths and not flaws at all. And so for me, really, there is like Percy Jackson was pretty big, but like again, I didn't know, I had ADHD at the time. So I think it's kind of similar right. Where it's hard to think back. Like, but it's interesting. Cause I think back of like what character types that I like relate to the most and that's it. Right. And that often overlaps with that sort of yeah. ADHD type, right?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. Whereas like I am looking at type really resonated with like the older sister types of like the people who were really smart, but they had to be. Yeah. So
Speaker 2:Yeah. No, well, I mean we, one of the things that Jordan and I talked about pretty early on in our friendship was like, what sort of vibes do we give off? Like in any given situation, that's pretty much how we became friends basically, but we sort of decided that Jordan has big like eighties movie, best friend energy,
Speaker 3:Best friend and her own calm. Yup. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Like totally mom friend prepared, uh, nurturing and caring, but also like will kill someone for you and help hide the body. Like a little bit wacky. Yeah. But like, but trustworthy. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And then what was, what was mine again? I think yours very specifically was like a low powered, which
Speaker 3:Who sits in a women's restroom at a club and compliments drunk girls and uses magic to fix their makeup.
Speaker 2:Oh, yup. Yup. And it's just like, it's like sitting on the couch, like a closed cigarette. Yes. Yeah. So that's a little bit more. Yeah. But like, but that, that sort of like not totally human, not morally gray, but entertaining. Yeah. Somewhere between like chaotic good and true neutral. So chaotic, neutral. So often on those, like tag yourself, like where do you fall on the, on the alignment chart? Where do you fall on the alignment chart? But it's like half the time I land on like chaotic good or like a third of the time I land on carry out a good blank, two thirds. It's almost always like chaotic evil. And I've like, I don't mean to, like, I don't mean to sit that way or like hold a pen that way. Like it's just the most trivial things. Right. Or like one of them was like, how you hold your drink. Oh yeah. And I was like, Oh no. And I can't remember what cat evil, like his cat evil. Wasn't the like grab it around the rim.
Speaker 3:Arctic evil was just like putting your hand halfway in the cup and grabbing the side of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Okay. So not that one. No. You know, mine was a lawful evil, which is when you grab the, I think we've all gotten that sometimes though. How reliable that one's, that one's feels very circumstantial. That one feels very like, I don't know. Like when I, when I first watched by Manor and Danny played by Victoria for training, just like is sitting at the bar, picks up the beer with her hand on top of the cup, around the room and it's almost full and just tips it and sips it like that while like looking at a newspaper and it is so funny, it's a very specific mood, but also like, I hate that I've done that, especially with like being hunched over and you just kinda like, you know, Oh my gosh, Oh anyways,
Speaker 3:That's relatable. I would be lying if I said I hadn't done that, but it's usually just one, the coffee cups hot.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah. And so I think you're like, that is very circumstantial, but anyways, I don't mean to fall on so much in the evil row or column or whatever. I don't think, I don't think I'm evil either, but I do think I'm definitely in that morally gray area as a person. And I just, we all need to accept that. Oh yeah. Let's just say that upfront right now. Okay. As your hydroflasks
Speaker 3:It says chaotic. Stupid. I love you.
Speaker 2:It's like a sticker. It doesn't say like, don't talk, that'd be wild.
Speaker 3:You pay extra for the Hydroflask to just don't go.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Oh, well I got some good stickers on here.
Speaker 3:That'd be really helpful if there was a Hydroflask was like, you bought me to stay hydrated.
Speaker 2:Drink some water. Yeah. God. Yeah. You're looking crusty. Yeah. Well I really do have some stickers on here. You do. One of them just says Yee haw. You haul official Bigfoot search team. There's a crystal ball. And it just says babe, with the power.
Speaker 3:That's a good one. Thank you. I don't have my water bottle here. Cause I'm just drinking juice, but juice. I respect your sticker game and a Hydroflask call us. We have an idea for you. I think we could work out a sponsorship. Yeah. Uh, have your people call our people?
Speaker 2:Yeah. By that Jordan means called Jordan is I, I am not on that. End of things at all. Are people. Yeah. Might as well just be upfront that I'm not the business. I'm not the one with the business acumen, but it feels
Speaker 3:A little bit desperate to be like, Hydroflask call
Speaker 2:Me fair. Hydroflask having a light into these DMS. Okay. Sorry. What were you horrified by? I was just thinking about like a Hydroflask like filled with like lube DMS. I know, I know it's real bad. Real fast. Why I made a bad face because my brain was like, Hey, what if a Hydroflask was just full of lube? And I said, Hey brain, why the do you care? And my brain was like didn't, but now I thought about it. Now I got to see it through, we started this journey. The doors are locked. Let me out, let me out. I don't like it here. This is not a nice place. Yeah. Um, anyways, so, so going back
Speaker 3:To that idea of character
Speaker 2:Types. Yeah. I can't believe I was like, well, we're actually talking about things of substance and then as soon as done that,
Speaker 3:Can I interest you in a Hydroflask fill with lube?
Speaker 2:That'll be$20. Thank you.
Speaker 3:It's actually a really good deal for a Hydroflask.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, that that'll be um, okay. Thank you. Shark tank. I will we'll catch you later. I don't know how that show works. I don't watch it. Don't either. Why would I watch shark tank? No idea. Should I maybe, but I don't want to can't make me, I wasn't gonna can't make me participate in actively trying to be a venture capital.
Speaker 3:I absolutely was not going to do that. Um, let's finish this episode though. Cause I have to pee. Oh yes. Representation. Would you like to see is my next question?
Speaker 2:I want more genomic GFEs I want more characters who are not quite so quote unquote ADHD, right? But like what seems actually accurate to what it's like to be someone who's not a cisgender white man or a cisgender white boy. Who's neurodivergent I, uh, I guess we didn't really touch on Juno that much, but Jr. McGough canonically has ADHD. Um, and Juno is the movie about the girl who gets pregnant and starring Elliot page and Michael Sarah. So like, if you don't know, I don't know how to help you. You should watch it. I really like it. It's one of my favorite movies of all time. Me and my cousin Marmara can quote probably the whole thing, word for word, but there's this sort of emotional vulnerability combined with impulsivity, but also combined with this coping mechanism of like humor and sarcasm and wits to cover up just how deeply scared and alone she feels. That
Speaker 3:Makes sense. Absolutely. That like, yeah,
Speaker 2:She gets pregnant in high school, decides to have the baby and give it up for adoption. Uh, finds parents to adopt the baby, uh, played by, um, Jennifer Garner. And I don't remember who plays the dad who cares. Um, Jennifer is the only one who matters in that, in that area of the movie. But she gets to know the parents, like the senior parents of the child, she's caring and she's going through being a high schooler, who's pregnant and still going to school and not even dating the person who the baby was conceived with. Can't get over to the plate by Michael, Sarah. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3:Who admittedly has all of the sex appeal of boys in high school, as far as I remember, which is to say none.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's fair. But I think that sort of just the way that she copes with ADHD and that like clearly so smart and has ideas and plans and is creative, but doesn't necessarily have the tools to make those things happen in a way that society deems appropriate.
Speaker 3:And what I really appreciate about her story is it's not about her having ADHD and it's not any problem that is typically ADHD oriented. Like she's not having problems in school and figuring out how to try to get her grades up and remember stuff, but the thought pattern and how she solves the problem she does have makes so much sense.
Speaker 2:Yes. Yeah. Also she has a hamburger phone. Yeah. It was dope. Yeah. I like ma I wanted a hamburger so bad that makes me want to get a landline.
Speaker 3:There's no reason for that, but like
Speaker 2:Her phone. Yeah. I just, Oh man. I and I, and the thing that I really appreciate, right. Is like obviously still a representation in terms of like, again, not a character that's based around their ADHD, but a F like a fully fleshed out character who also is played by such a good actor, like Elliot page. Like they are just so I know that we all love Elliot page. I know that. I know that I'm like preaching to the proverbial choir. Yeah. I know that. But he knocked that one out of the park. Yeah. No like Elliot page, just the, um, the skill to play that role in such a way that makes it really truly believable and heartfelt while still being entertaining. Do you know what I mean? Like that balance, like they like being able
Speaker 3:To do the comedy and the nuance at
Speaker 2:The same time. Like he like, yeah. He knocked that one out of the park. So again, I know we all know this. I know we all love Elliot page. Juno is good. The podcast basically. And it doesn't help that that movie came out in what, 2007, 2008. So like right when we were both like mid middle school going into high school sort of range. So that was so formative for me generally. Um, but also like looking back just really like, yeah. Feeling so seen by the way that Juno is a character copes with her situation and with her life generally. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I didn't actually see that movie until I watched it with you, but a, the soundtrack was formative. Yeah. For that time, even if I hadn't seen the movie and B, I didn't think it was a movie I was gonna relate to because it's not a problem that would ever be
Speaker 2:In my sphere. But
Speaker 3:Then, like I said earlier, and like you've articulated because the way that Juno handles her problems and the depth that is there and the thought process makes so much sense. I really did. And I really, yeah. Really related to her,
Speaker 2:Well, it's like, technically, is it, isn't a movie about teen pregnancy technically. Yes. But if someone's like, what's Juno about like, really, like, what are the themes in the movie, Juno? I'm not going to be like babies. Yes.
Speaker 3:It's not a commentary on teen pregnancy really at all. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, some people do like to read it as a, either some people like to read it as a pro-choice sort of narrative. So people like to use it as like a pro-life sort of narrative. And then I'm sitting here like LA like, well, like, but also like hamburger, phone and Elliot page, Jennifer Garner, the actor who plays Gino's dad. Oh, what is his name? I'm so sorry, but he, um, I'm gonna, it's gonna bother me. I'm so sorry. Um, but like you're telling me that Jennifer Garner Elliot page and Scott Pilgrim himself, Michael, Sarah, right? Like you're telling me that, Oh, JK Simmons. Yeah. JK Simmons. You know, you're telling me that those actors are in a movie that completely misaligns with their political views. You okay. Um, so I just, yeah, I do think that there's a lot of controversy surrounding that movie and I get it from a like cultural perspective, but from an ADHD and personhood perspective, it's max absolute. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks to heat coyote. Ugly is cactus. Almost things as much as your abandonment, I'm so impressed with how
Speaker 3:Quickly you whip that out and the commitment that was deep, deep rooted. Thank you. Yeah. I don't know what I would do without you.
Speaker 2:There was some blue gunk in my earn. Did you borrow from my earn? I would. I would never burp in your earn. I really Liberty bell. If you put one more bake on that potato, I'm going to kick your little monkey, but I know I told you like almost word.
Speaker 3:No, it's incredible. I just feel guilty because I feel like I'm not holding up my end of the Juno quoting bargain here.
Speaker 2:You know what? I'm just going to know that Marmar listens to this podcast. Hi, Marmar. I remember and will probably say the other parts of the quote out loud. Oh, perfect. Wherever she listens.
Speaker 3:Thank you. Marmar for picking up my Slack. We appreciate you.
Speaker 2:I love you so much. Yeah. Yeah. Oh no. Yeah, no. This is just very, very quickly deteriorated into me just being like, so Juno is the best movie of all time. Here's why
Speaker 3:To continue on that train. I will say one of the things that I like about Juno and one of the main things I want to see more about is I don't want to call it the love languages, but the way that people understand and show affection to each other is so specific to that person. That's what I would want to see more of an ADHD representation. Not necessarily like the ADHD characters themselves, but the people in their lives that they love and the people in their lives that they interact with. Like getting to see more of people being intentional about that and how to do that. I think. And also I think it is really necessary for people to see character that they relate to, especially if they relate to their flaws, be able to be loved. And so that would be my, what I would want to put in that stew, that representations do
Speaker 2:Ouchie, bro.
Speaker 3:I didn't mean it as an ouchie.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no. Sorry. Just like it was very vulnerable and it sounded a little bit like you were choking up at the end and I can see your face. So I know that you're not sad. I'm not that audio sort of journey that you just took us on ouchie, bro. Like the, I want to see people with ADHD be loved ouchie, bro. Yeah. Oh, I think this one's kind of obvious my, add it to the list anyways, pop it in there. I would love to see more characters who are not white and not cysts and you know, maybe have other, uh, other disabilities. Yeah, yeah, no, I would just, I would love to see more, more actual people lame represented generally, but also with ADHD. Yeah. I would love that. Um, that'd be great. It would be so cool. It's a good thing that we are, you know, writing too many scripts, probably arguably, but like it's a good thing that we do, you know, really putting our, uh, proverbial money where our mouth is, you know,
Speaker 3:Be interesting to look back. I think once those projects are finished and see how many people unprompted or like, I wonder if that characterization HD. Yeah. I wonder if Bigfoot,
Speaker 2:Okay, listen, listen. That is the question of the ages. Yeah. Okay. But that implies that we have a script about Bigfoot, which we do, but they didn't need to know that. Forget this happened.
Speaker 3:Now I just want to know about which cryptids have ADHD.
Speaker 2:Hmm. That's probably a good one for next step sewed. Just kidding. I think we already have next steps planned.
Speaker 3:I think we do, but I think we do need an episode about which cryptids have ADHD. Yeah. I mean, somewhere on the Ross,
Speaker 2:Like in my list of dopamine trampoline stuff, like cryptids, there are several different cryptids just on that list. So
Speaker 3:Do you want to do that now? Or should we save that for the cryptid episode
Speaker 2:For the crypto desk episode? Because I know you said you had to pee and I am quickly losing steam.
Speaker 3:Okay. Do we have a dove main trampoline in this episode? No. We're just talking about like character characters that we love. So yours was Juno and mine is, I guess that would make mine the, uh, Jason Vermeer and the subsequent books afterwards, which I'm just going to say are dope. I read the first one in fourth grade and it's about these two kids who solve like an art theft mystery, but what's really cool about them is it's an art theft mystery that's set in Chicago. Yeah. The art is gorgeous. The books are very smart. The two main characters have really good names and their names are Petra and Calder. And I feel like that really set the name bar high for me for like character names. Like I don't want to listen to your mats, no offense to anyone named Matt. There's lots of people that I love named Matt, but like I was like, wow,
Speaker 2:That's a, you know, a lot of people in my mat do.
Speaker 3:And if you're a man who's listening to this, I care very deeply for you and hope you're having a wonderful time. That was it.
Speaker 4:Terrible example. I'm going to try again. I don't want
Speaker 2:Your, your Johns or your marks
Speaker 3:Now. I'm just listing books of the Bible. I'm doing bad.
Speaker 4:I can't wait. I don't want your Alexa. Please just keep at it. Yeah. Actually though, like you Jeff
Speaker 2:[inaudible] I want to Sue for emotional damages. My name is Alexa and my life has been hell
Speaker 3:And this has been Orland park, my whole heart wholehearted production company. Sorry. That was aggressive. You're right. And you should say it. Thank you. Yeah. I guess
Speaker 2:It's really just sort of rambled, but I don't think that we really wanted to come at you with some hot and ready energy today because
Speaker 3:We're all, uh climatizing to the new year and getting settled and going through a Hulu. Yeah. Yeah. But we would love to hear if there are any characters that we missed or what else,
Speaker 2:Let us know which characters we missed. How about that?
Speaker 3:We do want to hear it. We want to hear what characters don't exist yet, but really should tell us about your ADHD writing projects. Tell us about what food you would like a phone shaped as well. Anything else this week,
Speaker 2:Stay hydrated, stay hydrated, but you know, don't stop paying attention because there are things that we really do need to be paying attention to. But also please put your phone away. Like I, I wanted to sit down and take a walk. Yeah. Like just take a breather, right? Like there's only so much we can do and in a calendar day. Yep. So hang in there. We love y'all. We're glad to be back.
Speaker 3:So are the cats? Yes. Cancer
Speaker 2:Cats are quite happy that the blanket Fort studio is back in business.
Speaker 3:Yes they are. Should we sign this one out before they tear it down? Yeah. Yeah. Right. This has been or learn par Corp from wholehearted production company.
Speaker 2:Find us on Spotify, Apple podcast, Stitcher, any place where cool people find their podcasts, basically
Speaker 3:Special. Thanks to Krisha Pareto for our cover art design. You can find her at pedal hop. That's P E T a L H O P on Instagram and Etsy and Twitter. She's got some very cute Valentine's day stuff up in her shop. So check it out. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And thank you to Tom Rosenthal for our theme song, there is a dark place off of the album. Keep a private room behind the shop.
Speaker 3:You can follow us on social media at, or learn par Corp on Twitter at we are WPC on Instagram and on our website, which is we are WPC doc
Speaker 2:Calm. Yeah. And you can find all those links plus links to sources, transcripts music, and social media and all that. Good. Good, good, good, good, good stuff in our description. Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I know, thank you for everyone who is been patient us uploading our transcripts. We are getting those up as soon as we can. And we appreciate you a lot. If you enjoy this podcast and would like to hear more, please, don't forget to describe to this feed, wherever you're listening.
Speaker 2:And you could also support the show by sharing the show with a friend or family member, leave us a review, uh, or, you know, if you're so able, you could support us on[inaudible]. That is in our link tree, which is on both our Instagram and our Twitter. Sure is. I do have a question for you. Take us out on this one. So let's talk about camp. Half-blood let's talk about being a Demi. God, who would your godly parent be?
Speaker 3:My gut instinct is Artimus but I feel like part of his thing was that she didn't have a kid.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no Artemis, like there's a whole thing where there's like a Legion of young women who also don't want to, uh, get married or anything. Can
Speaker 3:I be in that? Can I do that one? Hell yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, I think a lot of the people who end up in Artemis group, aren't like, they, they do have other godly parents, but then they go to, I can't remember what they're called. I haven't read those books in so long. I should read those books again. Hell yeah. 2021 do something that makes you happy.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. I don't know who my parents would be, but I think I want to be in the Artemis club. I can see that do archery and like talk to deer and stuff. So I want, I choose that. I picked that one.
Speaker 2:What about you? Based on multiple quizzes and even some you quizzes. So say, you know, I invested time into this. That's legit. I have taken time out of my life to take quizzes about Percy Jackson, Demi God camp half-blood cabins because I'm an adult. And I do what I want Zeus Zeus though. I feel like he probably has the biggest cabin, right? No, because the big three Zeus Haiti's and Poseidon, since they're like the three most powerful gods and like the ones who are in charge of like all the big things, right. Then they're brothers, uh, they like made a pact to not have kids, but then of course they still around.
Speaker 3:I was like, I thought that was kind of sous this whole thing
Speaker 2:Sort of, but he is still married to Hara. And like the whole thing is that like, there's very few Demi gods who are children of Zeus Haiti's and Poseidon. And so that's why like Percy Jackson is kind of a big deal. Cause he's beside me, he's a son of Poseidon. Yeah. But yanno Zeus or Jupiter probably Zeus let's be real. I don't have the discipline to be one of the Roman Demi gods, but it doesn't matter. This isn't real, but I do have a owl. So I do have a big affinity for like
Speaker 3:The sky. Yeah. I was going to say like fender. Yeah. That's also a great, also like imagine dragons song.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But also like Zeus, you know, cocky but capable. So like you still kind of have to let them do stuff, even though you hate them a little, you just can't stop them. Yeah. Sometimes I do have that energy. It feels about right. Yeah. So, all right. Well, uh, I'm Jordan and the Artemis club and I'm Lex child of Zeus. And this has been for all learn PARP. We'll see you in two weeks.
Speaker 1:[inaudible].
