In this episode, Lex & Jordan take a certain genre of mental health thinkpieces to task. After finding too many articles about why relationships with ADHD folks are apparently the worst thing that can happen to you, we're speaking (yelling) out about why everyone is hard to love in their own special way and why that's actually fine! Good even!
CW/TW: Mental health, ADHD, loud noises, yelling, mouth noises, coughing, prescription drugs
Thanks for listening!
There is a dark place, but I'm not going that. No, no, there is a dark, butSpeaker 2:
Hi, I'm Jordan and I'm L and this is or learn park core, uh, podcast about ADHD and not park core. It's done by two complete idiots who have ADHD and do not do parkour. Yeah. Big dream to maybe someday do it. But I mean, I'm near and 30 and these joints are crackling. Well, we'll just hold off until you get'em replaced and then we'll go right to it. That's a good, what is new? That's a good call, actually. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I bet that's exactly what the doctors want me to do after I get all my joints and stuff replaced. Yeah. Gotta gotta break.'em in. They're like docs. Okay. Uh, well, welcome everybody. Um, we're not experts, but we do have ADHD. So we like to share our experiences with you. And for some reason, a lot of you keep listening and partaking I'm concerned for you.<laugh> but, uh, grateful. So, thanks. Yeah. Thanks for joining us. On another episode of L L P we are going to share our experiences and in particular, this week, my experience has been rage. Okay. Because people on the internet are mean, oh, not to me specifically. Okay. But who do I need to fight then? Who? Sorry, everyone for my brief pause there. Kill bill sirens. We're going off inside my head. No, that's fair. Honestly, you probably don't need to kill anybody. It's probably some like underpaid SEO intern, just churning out mediocre blog posts. Okay. I'm very confused. What's happening? Oh, for like mental health websites, because cool. If you search and Google relationships and ADHD, the entire first page, the entire first couple pages that come up are like, why dating somebody with ADHD is the worst. Why they're terrible and irresponsible. And you probably feel unloved in this relationship. Cool. Can you tell everyone at home why you were Googling that? Because I know, but this is kind of a bummer way to start the topic in a week. I will admit your rage is so valid. Can't wait to dig deeper, but maybe let's give'em some context. We're talking about our favorite things about being friends with people who have ADHD and being in relationships with people who have ADHD. That is a much more positive spin. We should have started with that. I mean, that's what we talked about, what we were gonna talk about. And then you came in here, like I am full of rage and I I'm so ready to make space for that, but that's not what I came prepped with. I came prepped with my own little list that I came up with. That's just my reasons for liking, being friends with other people who have ADHD in my defense. I did, when I pitched this episode, say I'm tired of reading those articles so we should do something. That's the opposite. Yeah. So I think that's in my defense. That's that's fair because I'm the one bringing the positive. You are bringing the positive as here. Yeah. And you're the one who brought the rage, which is fine. Cannot stress enough how fine that is. And I'm, I am ready. I'm ready to dig back in those kill bills. Irons. They've quieted down, but they're still there more or less don't you wanna go rape sometimes that's the secret. I'm always going ape.<laugh> um, yeah. So love the different approaches that we took. Do you think mark RLO has ADHD? Probably most actors seem to that's fair. Like most like, oh, well, a lot of us, a lot of us seem to have it.<laugh><laugh> well, well, that'd be fun. Have him on the show. Yeah. Well that would be fun. Great. Maybe for like my 30th birthday episode, you can do like a 13 point on 30 podcast episode. That would be so fun. Right? I love that movie. Okay. Everyone, you got it. Now we have to get Jordan and me let's to the level of fame where mark ruffler will notice us and know who we are and want to come on our podcast. So, uh, you know, Twitter do your thing. Ha, please, please, actually though. I mean, maybe not like that, that famous would be kind of scary, like the type of famous, where you have to have like a bodyguard and like security around your house. I wanna be that kind of famous. Exactly. Like I wanna be like Sufi on Stevens, famous where everyone's like, I know who that is. I bets Jan Stephens, that guy, he wears several hats and is very sad and no one knows where he is ever. I bet if Sufi on Stevens had a podcast and asked mark Rello to be on it, he would. Right. I don't know. I guess we wouldn't know because we would have to ask mark Ruffo if he likes Sufi and Stevens, and I don't know how we can do that without having him on the podcast. So we're kind of in a little over Barris greet our own tails. Mm-hmm<affirmative> as pre usual, we've gotten wildly off track. So let's talk about relationships in ADHD to clarify, we're talking about any kind of relationship, but a lot of these articles do seem to be geared towards romantic relationships yet again, getting in line with the rest of our wild and wacky culture that just loves to focus on monogamous relationships in a romantic setting and nothing else. That's no other relationships matter. your family. your friends. your kids. No, thanks. It's just me and my very sad, tumultuous, unhealthy, romantic relationship. And that's the way it should be. I'm fine. And just like Shaq always says, them, kids. them, kids.<laugh>. Yeah. That's another part of where the rage comes from is I never once specify romantic relationships when I was looking these things up and the two options online are romantic relationships or like parent and child. And then some of the articles about romantic relationships were like, your problem is you're probably treating your ADHD partner like a child because they're irresponsible and can't be trusted with anything deeply insulting, all kinds of bad, just all kinds of bad from every angle. So thank you for clarifying that Lex, we are talking about any sort of valuable, important caring connection between people mm-hmm<affirmative> and specifically we're gonna combat some of that. Yeah, we are. Cause like we're ADHD people. We're BFFs and we have been for several years and we are. Yeah. I love you so much, bro. I love you so much, bro. God clearly going super well for us so far, we are podcasting in a closet. We're podcasting in a, okay. I take APIC. When I say it, it sounds a little sad. Take us to the rage. Come on, pick a back, pick up the in here and it's cozy and I'm hanging out with my best friend and besties who sweat together, sweat a lot together. Cuz we live in Chicago and boy, how it sure is a swamp. Yep. It is. It is literally it literally is. And it's a very nice actual, like mid to low seventies day. That doesn't matter too much when you're in a like foam covered closet. No, probably not at all with little battery disco lights, which are so cute. Wouldn't trade it. They're incredible. They're so good. They're probably not generating not much heat. That's just our love for each other. Yeah. And our other friends and family members with ADHD and our hatred of the people who wrote these articles, which brings me back Jordan. Yeah. Let's skip back to that rage. How does it make you feel mad? Yeah. Okay. Bad. Yeah. I should probably not yell so much. This is an audio medium, you know? Sorry. Y'all I mean we can edit it.<laugh> we can fix it in post. Maybe if it wasn't just shot off the charts. Oh, we'll find out it's a little Clipy it's it's a little, it's a little Microsoft word assistant up in there. Yeah. It's just a little, just a little super cut. Clip. The it's a little D we help with that document up in here. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I love that. We went for two different types of clips. Just a little like your body's halfway through the floor and your arms are straight out and uh, the video game. Oh, clipping through. Okay. Yeah. I was like, yeah, it's a, like a David digs. Yeah. Rap wrapping persona. Huh? So good clipping. Listen to clipping if you happens. But our sauce just clipping me. Oh, like a piece of a plant, like a piece of a plant, like a newspaper article. Yeah. Wow. Like a mom where we're doing coupons, coupons. Very important. We're doing umbilical cords. I mean, I think you kind of snip those. Ah, that's very different. Yeah. Like I think you actually cut it like this, this nails. Yeah. You click your nails. We are doing, like, I thought that I was like, ha ha. What? How many, how many versions is the word clipping? Are there? There's a lot. There's money. There's a lot fast going fast, clipping along. Oh yeah. Going on a good clip. Especially on a boat. I feel like that's a Boaty. I feel like it's horsey with in, in tandem with a good clock. Yeah. The Clipy poppy. Yeah.<laugh> I don't know why we saying could be cl like that really sent me, but I'm glad that you also kinda lost it there. The brief silence. No, don't laugh. Don't laugh. It's stupid. It's a stupid thing to laugh at. But could, could be clap<laugh> it just feels funny in your mouth. Yeah. If you're able to wherever you are right now, give it a, go. Give it a try. Wait. Say clicky. Clappy. Do it. Tell me you're not getting a little it's funny. Right? It's kind of funny. Clicky clappy.<laugh> you're welcome. Yeah. Stop laughing.<laugh> copy that.<laugh> get out. No, we're recording my laptop's in wave. Yeah. That's fair. Okay. So rage and anger. Yes. And hatred. Uhhuh fighting. Killing. Screaming. Yes. Drugs. Yeah. Okay. But not yelling. Yeah. Okay. We got it. We got this. Um<laugh> yeah. It hurts my feelings.<laugh> up. This is funny. My feelings. This has been oral or brick or bye riding away in mahi.<laugh> oh man. Don't ride away. Mahe just cuz you got your feelings hurting. Come on, wheelies back over. Steel's your nurse prepare for that.<laugh> okay. Take it back. I understand why people don't wanna hang out with us. I mean, well they're stupid. That's fair. You dumb as. You're so dumb. Hey, you know what? You should, you should. Wow. I'm trying to think of a good thing to say. That'd be funny. Uh, but it always in my head, every, every saying just comes out incredibly mean and offensive. So I'm gonna hold that back. Okay. But go yourself. People who write these people who write these articles. Okay. Can I, can I briefly amend that? Can I say go yourself. People who request these articles? Because like I said, I'm sure there's some poor like marketing intern. Who's like this sucks that they need to eat, I guess, I guess. But aren't they mostly, I don't know. I don't know the demographics of blog writers these days, but mental health blogs. I immediately picture, I don't know, like a mom who like a Pinterest mom. Yeah. Yeah. And in that case I'm like, go yourself. That's fair Ella. I was like, I can't think of anything. That's not incredibly mean and insensitive. So I'll settle on something a little lighter, a little easier. Go yourself. Eat. Just AB shove. So many wads of sandpaper up your. Okay. Sit right on a cactus with the sandpaper in your. Yep. Get in there. Mm-hmm<affirmative> hurts. Doesn't it put some pink sauce on your cereal and eat it.<laugh> oh my God. Okay. Okay. So I think we've probably established our bias in this argument. Yes. Um, I, that I, I would argue being to people who have ADHD and have personally, we both have a lot of friends, not in a like ha I'm so popular way. But like we, we both have a lot of people that we're friends with and we care deeply about and they care deeply about us and that's lovely. Yeah. And you know what, but none of'em read these articles and let's hope that they don't cuz like Jordan gives us a little sample. Yeah. Give us a little taste. What do these things say? Let me just, let me just, uh, lemme just pick one up here. Okay. First article that comes up, adult ADHD in relationships. This is what the snippet of it on Google says the first sentence. It gives you. If you're in a relationship with someone who has ADHD, you may feel lonely, ignored and unappreciated. You're tired of taking care of everything. Great. start Uhhuh. Mm-hmm<affirmative> second article, your ADHD relationship. Survival guide is like what is this NEDs de classified. Exactly. It's not, you're not that cool. Are we something that you need to survive? If you feel like you need to like survive your partner, there are bigger problems. Yeah. Let's just take a bee there. Right? Like don't be in a relationship if you feel like you're literally fighting for survival in it. I promise there are more fulfilling ways to spend your life<laugh> yeah. So jot that down. Continue mm-hmm<affirmative> oh yeah. Uh, so the snippet for this one is the partner with ADHD may skip chores or leave jobs unfinished or constantly misplace the car keys or lose important papers, disorganization.dot do it goes on to say more, but like that's that's the snippet. Well next article that comes up there's more is six ways. ADHD, sabotages relationships, a ADHD in relationships. How a D D can hurt couples. God you'd think that like we are the weapons of mass destruction that Bush reside all those years ago.<laugh> sounds like we can do a lot of harm if I would've known this earlier. I would've harnessed it. Is this what they mean? When they say ADHD is a superpower? Am I actually a super villain? Am I fan just, just snap and everybody who writes like this will disappear. Refresh it. So they're wrong? No. They're wrong. Yeah. Yeah. See, there we go. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the vibe. That's the vibe. There is a very pervasive, like stereotype and assumption about what being in a, any kind of relationship with someone with ADHD is like whether it's romantic or platonic, well familial or undefinable. And I think first and foremost, if that's the information that you constantly get, whether you're someone with ADHD or not, it's going to color the way you feel and color the way you act and color, the way you view the person that either you are or who you are in a relationship with. And it sucks. It sucks to like, get that message of like, you are too much, you are irresponsible and you can't be trusted and you're just hurting the people that you love. And you're an effort to take care of. Mm-hmm<affirmative>, here's the thing. Here's the thing. And this is my thesis statement of this whole entire thing. I'm gonna drop it now. Okay. That is how thesis statements usually work. You start like with a little bit of an opener and then you hit'em with a thesis statement mm-hmm<affirmative> and then you support your argument. So here we go. Everybody takes effort to love. Everybody is a person with their own quirks and positives and negatives and we're all human and we're all going to hurt each other sometimes. And we're all gonna figure out how to love the people in our lives that we wanna keep in our lives as best we can. Yeah. And whether or not those quirks positive or negative have something to do with ADHD. Maybe they do. Maybe they don't, you don't have to have ADHD to be a bad partner. There are plenty of reas. There, there are plenty of ways to be a bad person and be unkind to people that have nothing to do with ADHD. Yeah. And likewise, as a person who has a lot of friends that I love very much with ADHD, you can be a wonderful kind person. Mm-hmm<affirmative> yeah. Mean a pretty, pretty solid thesis statement. I, I get behind that. Thanks. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I have my master's degree now. I don't have the authority to give you that, but if they could give me one, they should probably give you one<laugh>. Yeah, but that might cost money. Not if you get a teaching assistantship or research assistantship. I didn't pay for my masters. I paid for my masters by working for the university. But if you're working for the university, then what job do you have that pays for? Like your food and rent and. I mean, it was a tight couple years.<laugh> yeah. That's why it's hard, but like you, you don't have to pay for it. That's fair anyways. Yeah. That's my soapbox. That's my bandstand. That's my okay. Sermon on the Mount. Oh, okay. Yeah. Can I so kind to each other? Yeah. Can I ask, like what, what are the most common things that they suggest? Like, what are like, is it, do you know what I mean? Yeah. Like what are the things about a partner or a friend with ADHD that are so bad that they had to write so many think pieces on it, like got together on shark tank to just on people with ADHD. Huh? Jesus. For real, it tends to circle back to the idea that people with ADHD are inherently irresponsible and they're going to continually disappoint you and forget about your needs. Hmm. Dang.<laugh> dang. Well, me. I guess. Yeah. Everyone avoid me cuz I'll hurt you somehow I guess, which I, I will. Cuz I'm a person. And so will the person in your life who doesn't have ADHD. Yeah, exactly. Has all to do with like the brain worms. Yeah. It's just like, sometimes people are. Sometimes there's misunderstandings. Like I feel like being able to say, oh it's ADHD is almost a benefit because like I said, anybody can do that. Yeah. But there is a huge difference between somebody like continuously forgetting about you and letting you down mm-hmm<affirmative> and somebody making that mistake from time to time. But being able to show that they're working hard, not to, and that they have a very valid reason. That's not that they don't care or they don't try enough. Cause there are certainly people who are just not trying enough. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Or again, it, it is kind of wild to me that it's like, if you forget your keys more than twice, you may or may not be going to hell<laugh> no, it really is like, that's kind of the vibe of like, they will forget to pay bills. They will forget about your anniversary. They will forget about your children. And it's like, what the? What do you think ADHD is? That's a fun fact. There's a, I think it was 1884 was someone with ADHD who coined the phrase, throw the baby out with the bath water.<laugh> that's probably doesn't help our case much, but it's fine. It's funny. That's of. I was lying to you. Oh, okay. I, I was like you said it was such authority<laugh> I was like, okay. Yeah. I'll believe anything. Honestly. I'm very gullible, but not because I'm like stupid. I'm just like yeah, sure. Whatever. Like someone's like you fell for it. I'm like fell for what? What did you say? I don't remember. And they're like, I just said it and I'm like, I know also there's a reason I'm not gonna make any claims as to how this phrase came about. But there is a reason that the phrase stranger than fiction exists, life is often that. Yeah. So if you come up to me and you're just like, oh, did you know that they discovered that applying peanut butter to the bottoms of your feet, that will make you grow taller. I'd be like, okay, I'm not gonna do it. But like, darn, I'm not gonna stop you. Yeah. No like, okay, if that's the hill, you wanna die on have fun. But it's like, I'm one of those people that someone's like, ha did you see Gus written on the ceiling? And I'm just already looking up cuz I'm lost in my thoughts. And then they're like, haha. Gotcha. And I'm like what? You wanna know something fun and not a bit or at all. The word gullable was actually written on the ceiling of my high school drama classroom. You. I didn't do it. No I know. But like your ilk, your kin you know who you are listening to this. Yeah. That's wild theater kids are so stupid. Yeah. Love all. Absolutely. Hey, so, uh, how about we combat all this negativity? Huh? Absolutely. And I do wanna say before we move on, if there is someone in your life that you care about and sometimes somebody's ADHD symptoms cause problems and you guys have to work on that together. I don't wanna say any of this to invalidate you, but you are clearly already a step ahead of all of these articles in that you're treating the people in your life. Like people mm-hmm<affirmative> that you are always going to have to figure out how to love best and grow alongside. Yeah. And I will say a lot of those articles, it feels a little bit like, and, and it, this, the point still stands. Whether you're you have untreated or treated ADHD, right. Mm-hmm<affirmative> the point still stands. People are people, but I can see how someone with untreated ADHD who may not know that they have ADHD could be experiencing a lot of those symptoms at a much higher rate. Mm mm-hmm.<affirmative> in the day in day out. And how that could be really exhausting for someone else. Yeah. But like you don't tell someone who's going through a bad depressive episode that they just need to love themselves first, before they can be loved by others. Mm-hmm<affirmative> well, some of you do, some of you do say that to people and I would advise you too kindly respectfully shut the up. Mm-hmm<affirmative> but you wouldn't tell your, the person with the broken leg that you're disappointed in them for not taking the dog for walks. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. So just like, think about it. Yeah. I would also like to piggyback and just reassure, like if you're struggling with your own ADHD or you're struggling to properly care for and love someone with ADHD in the way that you want to, we're not trying to invalidate that. Like God speed. It's just the tone of the, the tone and the frequency and the premise<affirmative> it's the premise that people with ADHD are automatically gonna be the worst and shouldn't be trusted or dated because by golly, they will make your life a living. Hell mm-hmm<affirmative> is sort of the energy, you know, mm-hmm<affirmative> and I don't know why I keep saying sort of, or kind of like that's the energy, that's the the message it is. So let's knock that back right on its fat. Actually. No, it's not good enough for having a fat. No flat. No, I don't wanna judge anybody. Yeah. I know. I was like, as soon as I said it, I was like, oh, well let's knock this thing on. It's stupid. It's UN wiped. It's unwise sticky, stinky and clean it. Just clean it up. Okay. Clean it up. Yeah. That's the point? Clean it, the up. It is. But let's still, let's go with some positive stuff. I personally wrote down a few things. Yeah. Let's hear'em about what I love about having friends with ADHD. First one built in the fact that they get it. Like that's sort of the base for most of these is that it's like, oh, you get it. You understand why this might be happening in my life. And I understand why it might be happening in yours or go, you know, agreeing that like if one of you's a little late that's okay. Cuz you're both probably a little late. Yeah. The, the fact that people, my friends with ADHD often don't mind that I'm like doing something on my phone or with my hands while we're talking. Cuz they know that I'm still paying attention. I just need to do something with my hands in order to pay attention. Yeah. And they don't automatically assume that I'm trying to ignore them. Oh the other big one is like telepathy. Yeah. Honestly, like I say, that sort of jokingly, but it's like when you get close enough to somebody who also has ADHD, AKA like how Jordan and I are a lot of the time mm-hmm<affirmative> we don't actually need to speak full sentences to one another like 90% of the time we can either just say a word or make a noise or even exchange a look. And we know mm-hmm<affirmative> we know what the other one is thinking. And other times we, it is happened so many times where we haven't discussed what we're about to say or talk about. And then we're like, Hey, I meant to talk to you about this. And then the other person's like, I literally was just thinking about that literally like right now mm-hmm,<affirmative> literally telepathy it's wild. And I think half the things we do say out loud are pretty much our own language. Oh yes. Unintelligible, completely unintelligible. So the outside listener, we really do our best to try and make this as, um, accessible as possible. I don't know that we do a great job of that, but we have you here, so thanks. Thanks. Sorry. God speed. God speed.<laugh> yeah. It's it. God, it's just a short little list basically. Just like people with ADHD are super creative. Like me, they think outside the box, like me. Yeah. Um, and it's just like a vibe. It's a wave of length of like, you know, sometimes and not always. Right. Mm-hmm<affirmative> like sometimes there's just different layers of neurodiversity that like sometimes we just can't parse and that's okay. Right. But NAMI and Jordan, mm-hmm got you got you. Hell yeah. What were yours? I have a list as well. And yes, to everything you just said, that's like, number one is just, when you meet somebody who has the same brain worms as you and they just get it, they just get it and you can click with people. Mm-hmm<affirmative> in a way Spider-Man in the middle of the street of each other. Truly. Yeah. Truly. It is. It's pretty great. It is unparalleled. And I am so grateful for the relationships in my life where I realize I probably have more friends from like early childhood that I talk to on a regular basis than most people. I get the impression when I mm-hmm<affirmative> talk about these people. Yeah. And it's cuz we click like that. Yeah. And it's, it's a beautiful thing and I am grateful for all of those people immensely. And I think that goes hand in hand with the second thing I was gonna say, which is like curiosity and sometimes tending into that hyperfocus zone. Mm-hmm<affirmative> but the, the passion and the interest that people with ADHD can approach things with. Mm. Because for better or for worse, we love novelty that great. Mm-hmm<affirmative> we also love oftentimes people pleaing, what<laugh> and that even of itself is maybe not the healthiest, but you do gain, I think a set of skills of understanding what people need and how they feel really quickly and really intuitively because it is at some points, a survival mechanism. But once you understand that and you can use it for good, I mean, that's, that's how you get people and being on the giving end of that feels really good when you can make somebody feel like that. Yes. And being on the receiving end of that, like I've then asked questions about my life and what I think about things, which is like very important to me in any kind of relationship by people with ADHD that I had never even thought about. And it feels really good to feel seen and feel like people want to get to know all of those things about you. Like that's a really special thing. And I think that ADHD people's natural curiosity like makes that happen in a really unique way. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. People with ADHD usually don't get upset when you ask a lot of questions. Yes. Yeah. It's really nice. I like genuinely people have thought I'm stupid for like so much of my life because I ask so many questions. It's like, I just don't wanna know. And I want clarity and if I'm not sure, like I'm gonna ask a lot of questions. Yeah. Like why are you upset? I'm trying to understand, you know? Yeah. It's ridiculous that that's something that's drilled into us that you shouldn't have to ask questions. But jumping off of that, another thing that I love about the people in my life with ADHD is hearing about their hyper fixations. Like tell me about that cool that you know, a ton of stuff about. That's awesome. Yeah. I love that. You know that I'm interested in it because you're interested in it. What random I love that you love that. I love love. Yeah. Yeah. Love ways. No like the enthusiasm and then the yes. The yeah. The enthusiasm and how contagious it is. Mm-hmm<affirmative> it's really cool. It is. Sorry. I'm not trying to hijack your list. I'm just no, yeah, you're right. You spent a whole bit talking about how we think a lot of the same things. Yeah. It's totally cool. If I say something and you're like, yeah, I think the same thing. That's super<laugh> yeah. Okay. I'll take that. Another thing I had on my list is resilience and creative problem solving. Mm. I feel like by and large and I'm, I will fully admit that this is a generalization. All of these are yeah,<laugh> right. Like we're coming in hot with the biases today. Oh, for sure. For, but like we acknowledge that these generalizations mm-hmm<affirmative> we acknowledge that this is not like the end all Beall of anything. Really? This is not relationship advice. No, God. No, God, no<laugh> but I would say there's a pretty stark difference between what happens if I've made plans with a fellow person with ADHD or a neurotypical person, and something happens to those plans. Mm-hmm<affirmative> mm-hmm<affirmative> I feel like if I make plans with a neurotypical person and they fall through, they get like really upset or they're like, how could, like, how could this restaurant close down? How could their like supply chain issues? I can't believe they don't have the thing that I wanted to do. Like there's a lot of like, oh, we can't do that thing. It sucks energy. Versus with someone with ADHD, it's one of two responses. One. Okay. Let's do something else. Let's take another thing to do. I have 10 different things I've been wanting to try. Let's go do one of them. We're still gonna have fun. We're gonna make whatever we do fun. Mm-hmm<affirmative> and that's great. Or two, which is also great then being like, great. We'll do it another time. I'm gonna go home and Uhhuh, maybe take a nap. Uhhuh.<affirmative> bye. And then I will also go home and take a nap and it'll be beautiful. It's gonna beautiful. I mean, big agree. Big agree. Uh, yeah.<laugh> God. It'd be interesting to hear like how other people feel about this. Yeah. Cause like, again, this isn't the end. I'll be all, but like I've always been pretty insulted by those types of blogs and it's pretty unfortunate that you kind of have to scroll to like second, third page Google to get any options that a aren't romantic partnership related or parent child relationships mm-hmm<affirmative> or like positive. I counted. Sorry. You counted how many, the first article that wasn't purely negative was the 24th, 24th page or 24th article article. So was it second page third page third page. Okay. It was third page. Well, I mean third or fourth, because there was also a ton of those like suggested article. Oh, like yeah. Infinite scroll on Google on the phone. Just awful for rank. Awful, awful but wild. So, and that article, that article was the challenges and benefits. At least they got both in there, but at the same time bananas truly. So it'd be interesting to hear what y'all think of like that sort of portrayal of all of us folks with ADHD and maybe how it makes you feel. And if it makes you feel similarly angry, tell us, yeah. Tell us we'll be there in solidarity. And if not really would like to hear other viewpoints like we're yeah. Like we are big fans of nuanced conversation and everything, but podcasts famously super good for once Uhhuh<affirmative> um,<laugh> there's great. Mm-hmm<affirmative> great. Research goes into all of our episodes. Yeah. We're always very intentional and serious with our conversations. Mm-hmm<affirmative> super academic always like just nonbiased yeah. You know, we try not to, we try to like take the personal ones out of it. Mm-hmm<affirmative> yeah, no, no lens here at all. None<laugh> Nope. No. Okay. So, I mean, I think having ADHD can suck sometimes, but it also rules and it doesn't make me a bad person to date. So that's my thesis statement to wrap it up, which is kind of the same as yours, just in a different, more aggressive, personal note. Did you have anything else to add? Did I have anything else to add? I didn't have anything else on my list. I just wanna check before I ask you to jump, jump, jump, jump, jump, jump, jump. So the Domine trampoline a boy's do yeah. Welcome to the dopamine trampoline. Otherwise known as DT. Uh, it's the place where we like to hop on over and talk about things that have been giving us dope mean lately or sometimes things that gave us dopamine in the past. Um, sometimes it's childhood. Sometimes it's like, I'll say two weeks ago, but it was actually like four months, cuz I don't know how time passes. It's it's circular. It's circular and flat. It's a flat circle. It's fine. It's like the boroughs from earlier. Yeah, exactly. Wow. We're really getting into some deep like ontological philosophical sort of discussions here. Mm-hmm<affirmative> oh anyways. So, um, what, what's your DT this week? What is the DT this week? Do you have a DT this week? I gonna think of it while you were panic panic.<laugh> oh, I have one. Oh, okay. Good. My dopamine trampoline is a new restaurant that I found and I didn't find, I didn't find it. Oh, say, did you discover it like Magellan? No, not to say Magellan discovered. Like none of them did right. There were people there before, but yeah, it's a turn of speech. You know what I mean? There were also people at this restaurant before, but it was the first time I found out about it. Uhhuh.<affirmative> new to you, new to me. Yeah. Like a already perfectly worn in pair of jeans. Yeah. So tell me about these, this denim restaurant. This restaurant restaurant GE Jean GE, right? GE it's a Jean restaurant. GE yeah. Okay. Tell me about the G. Absolutely. My coworker actually discovered this restaurant via Google and we had a work lunch there last week and it was way more fun than something called a work lunch would be I had some what? Oh, to be fair. Jordan's coworkers are really cool. They are. So there isn't really anything that could be construed as a boring work lunch for them. That's true. So like, I just mean all of your work lunches are fun. Oh yeah, absolutely. I just mean in the general corporate sense. If someone said work lunch to me, I would go hide in the bathroom until I died. Okay. So you're just imagining like a sad sweaty man eating a limp salad while doing his work and taking calls over lunch or like a lunch and learn situation where there are like PowerPoints involved and like the driest sandwiches you've ever had in your life. And you're like, at least there's a cookie in the end, but then somehow the cookie is also bad. Yeah. Like not even you thought it was chocolate chip and it was oatmeal raisin, but like just dry and crumbly, but not in a good way. Like in a way that makes it feel like styrofoam in your mouth. No flavor. I know the ones mm-hmm<affirmative> or cater cookies. Mm-hmm<affirmative> anyways. Okay. So you were on your work lunch. Oh yeah. That was not like that scenario that we just described. It's on my lovely work lunch. The fun, cool work lunch. Not like other work lunches<laugh> but we all, uh, it's an outdoor restaurant entirely. They don't even have an inside to sit. So I think they're closed over the winter, but it's up in Rogers park, right on the beach, which is nice. It's entirely outdoor. They don't even have an indoor to the restaurant. You have to walk to order and then you walk back outside. So a little more airflow, a little more safe, which was nice. And literally right by the beach, there were so many good dogs. There's a beautiful breeze. They have this, like it's not a covered patio, but they have like a cover frame that just has plants like a Perilla yeah. Kind. Yeah. Perilla esque like large scale commercial venue. Perla would frame with plants on it. It wasn't wood and it didn't look like it, it, I, because particles don't have to be wood that's fairs. Tradit are, but yeah. It's amount Perla. I take a back. I'm not schooled enough on the nuances of Perla is to confirm or deny whether the structure in question was a capital P Perla. But well, we just need to go back to find out, I guess we do. And we should because it was delightful. Amazing. Yeah. And good dogs on the beach. Good breeze. Good dogs on the beach. Good breeze. Good food. I had some pineapple jerk. Chicken nachos. Oh, huge. Serving one of those like hot dog boat, but like literally full. If you put another hot dog boat on top of it, it wouldn't touch the bottom hot, hot, like a proper Chicago American serving size. Mm-hmm<affirmative> mm-hmm<affirmative> okay. Mm-hmm<affirmative> say what you will about serving sizes here, but they're good for leftovers. They're great for leftovers. Uh, like the people who think that we eat it all in one sitting like, oh, across the pond, like, can you believe American portion sizes? They eat all of that. No wonder they have a problem, but it's like, okay, first of all, off. You have several problems that just, this isn't one of them. And uh, also, have you heard of styrofoam containers? Have you heard of leftovers? Geez. What do you use? You're oven for what's the point of a air fryer. If it's not to reheat those rain goons, bad news guys. You can't put beans in there. Sorry. Were you just taking a tar? Like you can't put beans in toast in air fryer. Yes. Get, Brits. Get Brits. I almost like to get, better. Get Brits. Anyways, food was really good. My coworkers said that everything they had was pretty good too. Uh, apparently the lobster role was a star. I personally have never had a lobster role in my life, but I like both lobsters and rolls. So I would be open to it. They had sangria, they have drinks. They have drinks. Okay, good. Yeah. It was like a, a be like a 12 ounce to go cup of sangria. Oh, shut the. Uhhuh. Oh, now we're talking. Okay. Yeah. So they got drinks. They go drinks. Okay. Okay. Yeah. I was like, yeah. I mean I love a good be. Most restaurants do have them, but I'll drink. I should have, I should have specified. I should have opened with that. A capital D drink. Yes, sir. Sorry. I said D like that just goes out. It's like that episode of work and moms where Ann and Lionel are trying to teach their daughter Alice self-defense and Anne starts talking about how you need to aim for the D mm-hmm<affirmative> and the balls basically. And then like, they just are like screaming like D D, D, D like, and Lionel is appropriately frightened of his wife in that moment. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I'm a little gender down. I'm sure. Oh, of course Anne, like it's part of the program. It is. Yeah. It's a significant feature. Not above. It's a part of the program program. The program. Ah, yeah, I get it. I get it. Now. It's such a good show. It's a great show. Um, is that your DT? No. Okay. No, it probably will be eventually I've been thinking about how I keep ringing, like TV and movies as my DTS. And like each time I do it, I'm like, this is stupid. I can't like play a clip for you all. I can't like give out my Hulu password to our entire audience. Yeah. Unfortunately my account would get shut down so fast. Like if I could, I would though. Mm-hmm<affirmative> just know that if I could, I would mm-hmm<affirmative> mm-hmm<affirmative> the corporation one. This one. It, but if I could give out all of my streaming passwords, I, I would, but I do hope that you all have been able to watch. Shorey read my DT from last episode. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I stand by it. All of it. It's a great show. Rewatched it again this past weekend. Cause I introduced yet another friend to it<laugh> and got them started on it. And so naturally after they left, I was like, well it's already playing. So I guess I'll just have to watch the rest of the season. Got it. Yeah. Mm-hmm<affirmative> match. Yeah, but that's not my DT. That's fair. The only other thing I'm gonna say this restaurant is that it's in a public park. So like I mentioned really good dogs, Uhhuh<affirmative> uh, it was very delightful. I was also talking to my director for the theater company that I work with on Monday and he was telling me about, oh my wife and I just tried this great restaurant by our house. It's called the waterfront cafe. And I was like, oh my God, that's it. That's the place. It's so good. So it is universally beloved by the seven other people you serve. Yeah. That's that's definitely universal. That's what universal means. Yep.<laugh> sure is. We're very, very credible on this podcast.<laugh> I've been go a lot of things in my life, but God credible never heard that one before. Yeah. Me neither. But that's probably cause I lie a lot. Credible. It's a low blow<laugh> anyways. That's my dopamine trampoline. Nice outdoor restaurant. Good sangria. I can't wait to go there with you. Yeah. I also didn't know this until we were already there and it was too late. They did not have them on their menu on the website, but they had it on the menu in like on their physical menu. Yeah. They have desserts. Oh, shut. They had a brownie and a strawberry shortcake. Oh, shut the up. Right? What Uhhuh? Hello? Yeah. Okay. Hold on. I know you said you should have led with the 12 ounce sangria. You should have led with the strawberry shortcake saving the best for last baby. Okay. Yeah. That's fair. It's dessert. Mm-hmm<affirmative> yeah, yeah, yeah. You're right. You're right. I am always very tempted to eat my dessert before anything else though? So no judgment, you know, as I say, life is short eat the short cake. Yep. That's how that phrase goes. It is. It is. It is. I want that to be the phrase so bad right now. I want to live that phrase. Yeah. I want strawberry short so bad. We do have fresh pineapple that we can cut up. That's true. We should make smoothies later. We should movies. Hecks. Let's do it. Sweet. I'm so sweaty. Yeah bud. What's your DT. Let's do it. Yeah. Let's whip through this. This uh, do you know why I like strawberries so much? Why do you like strawberry so much Lex? It's in my blood. You wanna know why? Because you are strawberry shortcake. Like the nineties cartoon character. No, but I did love her. Yeah. Like loved her. Who didn't, who didn't charming. So charming. And also like, her name is strawberry. I want my name to be strawberry. There you go. I could do that. I guess we figured out my name journey after all this long time. Um, okay. So, but it's in my blood cuz I'm a Fraser. We're doing it. Huh? We're doing it. So recently I've been doing some digging into my genealogy because long story short, my family on my mom's side comes from a long line of Appalachian hillbillies. I say that with all the love and respect in my heart, uh, who didn't give a flying about keeping birth and death records very well at all until like the mid 18 hundreds. And even then it's dicey<laugh>. So, um, we grew up with the understanding that my grandpa was Croatian and my grandma was a mu and she would refer to everyone as like, oh, we're just months mm-hmm<affirmative> when her last name was Frazier, the bastardized spelling of the Scottish Fraser. And I had never met my maternal grandmother. She died before I was born. She and my mom weren't very close. And so I never really heard stories about her growing up. That were good. So truthfully, uh, I don't really care that much about feeling connected to my grandmother or like feeling connected to my ancestors in that way. Mm-hmm<affirmative> but I'm one of those people that's been like, so like where are we from? Like I know grandpa was Croatian and we have like relatives and Croatia still like, that's cool. Like I'm a quarter Croatian, great whatever. But like dad's side, they can like trace a lot of people back to like England and Germany and like, you know, all the usual places where the whites come from. But what about mom's mom? Mm-hmm<affirmative> and my mom had no answers for me cuz grandma, Eva just said we were Mutz. And um, we are to be fair, which I did find out cuz I decided to just take the full plunge and get a DNA test and everything done too. So I got confirmation of a lot of things, but I also was able to piece together my maternal grandmother's lineage as a Frazier. And she's a direct descendant of like one of seven members of clan, Fraser of Lovett in the Scottish Highlands who immigrated to the United States specifically like North Carolina and Tennessee West Virginia, you know those areas. And if you're like, why does clan Fraser of Lovet sound so familiar? It's because it's the clan featured heavily in Outlander it's cause it's it's cause it's Outlander Jamie Fraser hunky redhead. Just we pray man, like smoldering dude from the Scottish Highlands, who's usually shirtless for no reason. Maybe being sweaty runs in the family. It does. I'm so sweaty. But like they, you know, if that's why it sounds familiar that that's cuz it's a big, it's one of the biggest Scottish Highland plants and they're known as the ferocious Frasers they have a saying, they have a saying it's just sweet pay, which is I am ready. Ready for what? I don't know. We're just ready. Okay. And so turns down, wait a second. Was SpongeBob Fraser I'm ready. I'm ready. Um, Uhhuh probably SpongeBob clan. Fraser of love. It confirms<laugh>. So lemme tell you a little bit about finding out that you're a part of a Scottish Highland clan, right. Or, or that you're a descendant of one. Tell us everything in your life up to this point starts to make a lot more sense. Yeah. When your family's just, just like, yeah, I don't know. We're all just kind of aggressive. We're all just like pretty loyal and like to have a good time. Um, but if you hurt one of our own, we will kill you and wouldn't, you know, it, that's a pretty common, uh, theme among clan. Fraser of love it. They're rowdy boys, rowdy boys. Like one of my ancestors, Lord Simon love it. He was the last person to be beheaded in the United Kingdom. Wild for treason. Nice, nice. Like the crown for real. Um, you know, yeah. And uh, a lot of people from Scotland, em immigrated to the United States. I'm not like one of a few there's many. Uh, and a lot of those families bred like rabbits. And that's another reason that it's kind of hard to keep track of all the lineage because it's these, these giant farming families that had like 20 kids each and like those kids had 20 kids each. And so it's like making that connection took me literally all night. I was digging through records all night. Mm-hmm<affirmative> I stayed up to do this. And I think you may recall a long time audience members that Jordan did this as well. Once stayed up very late. Mm-hmm<affirmative> almost all night looking up lineage type things and got some really funny information. Mm-hmm<affirmative> um, I didn't get anything funny on its own, right? Like no one in my family had silly names or like weird like that. No, no, no, no, no. Hannah burger Teeter no, no Hannah burger tees here. But think about how you have to reconcile the fact that you have my mom listens to this podcast had inappropriate thoughts. Okay. And may or may not have acted upon said inappropriate thoughts by yourself about a certain character in the show Outlander who happens to be hunky and redheaded and shirtless most of the time and always ready. And you find out that that's a fictional version of your like great grandpa. Like you're seven times. Great. Grandpa is Jamie Fraser. You're telling me that that Hotty is like the reason that I'm are you kidding me? So sorry.<laugh> I'm sorry bro. But it's fine. Like I'm fine. It's not like I'm related to Sam hug, hug, whatever the guy who plays Jamie in, uh, Outlander. We're not related. He's from a completely different clan in the Highlands. It's fine. We're fine. We're just cousins. We're just fine. It's fine. We're white. So it's normal.<laugh><laugh> just kidding. It's it's not normal. Please. Please. Don't do that. Um, actually it is pretty normal historically, but it's not now. So don't do that because we know what happens genealogically. Yeah, no, we know what happens with your DNA when you get yeah. You know, bad, bad, bad. Probably does explain why I'm so up. Sometimes generations of vein breeding. It's fine. I'll do it. Just a little icing on the cake with the whole whole DNA thing. Right. I get my results back and I'm able to tie things back to, you know, like the UK, France, Ireland, um, and obviously like Croatia in some other areas in the Balkans, like, like the Iberian peninsula showed up in there. I have no clue who in my ancestry is like Spanish or Portuguese, but I'll take it. And then also, you know, just call me Elizabeth Warren, cuz I got, I got uh, 0.1% indigenous American blood as well. Yeah. Which like that's not reflected in my family history. So let that sink in. Okay. I was not expecting that result. I do not claim that result just to clarify, like I'm not, but, but the, I spent two years of my life dedicating my entire academic career to learning about Pacific Northwest tribes. And this one, like one ancestor had to be looking down on me like the, like we're what the? Like they're they're on the other side of the country. What are you doing? What are you? You know? So, uh, anyways, that's been a lot to chew on, but also yeah. Uh, found out I'm descended from a Highland clan and they're notably one of the biggest fiercest rowdiest clans, granted, most Highland clans are mm-hmm,<affirmative> sort of par for the course. And that's what I appreciate about it at the house. Mm-hmm<affirmative> genuinely very sad history. Like didn't realize this before I found out all this genealogical stuff and I started doing more research, but you know, a lot of historians call what happened to the Scottish Highlands, uh, ethnic cleansing and genocide, which you don't hear that in history books these days probably cuz the crown doesn't wanna have yet another thing on its ledger, but you know, that'll it happened mm-hmm<affirmative> and they did, they sure did kill a lot of them, including one of my ancestors shopping his head off. Apparently he was a Dick. So like, you know, 50, 50, but like yikes had a little bit of a redemption aren't there. It sounds like. Yeah, no, I mean he was playing both sides of the field. Mm okay. So he was giving money to the crown as well as money to Charles Stewart, uh, in the rebellion. Mm. So he was playing both sides. Okay. And then got beheaded for portraying the crown. So, and now you have played stupid games when stupid prizes tattooed on your body. Yeah. Probably looking down on that one, like glad you figured that out before I did kid<laugh> yeah. So if you've been wondering, where does Lex get it from? And by it, I mean the ephemeral just like muchness, allot, Inness about me, the ephemeral muchness sounds like the like dark academia novel of our generation. Oh, I I'll get on that. I guess. There you go. Yeah. Now, you know, cuz I'm clan. Fraser of love it. I do have to ask the question that I'm sure all of our audience has been wondering and begging for an answer to, if you ask me which scene it was from Outlander, I'm gonna choking. I absolutely was not going to ask that. I would love to never ever know that. Thank you. Okay. I was gonna ask what does that have to do with strawberries? Oh yeah.<laugh> yeah. Fraser. Uh, it's a French. I know this one actually. It's a well, yeah, but if you don't know, uh, it's a French last name because a lot of Highland clans, uh, have French sayings and French names cuz of the stewards and whatever Scotland and France they've been besties for a while. If he besties like love, hate besties, frenemies. Yeah. Be yeah. But definitely closer to besties than England in France. Yeah. Buy one shot. So you England. But if you don't know, actually you're, you're the one good at French. Hit us with that strawberry word in French FRA. So Fraser, Fraser, FRA Fraser. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, there are actually two clan Frasers there's clan Fraser and clan. Fraser of love it. Clan Fraser of love. It is the one that I'm descended from. And that is the one that is located in Inverness. Um, and the other one is a lowlands clan or at least further south in the Highlands. So jot that down. But it is cute because both seals at different points in history have had strawberries in them. Yeah. Which I think is like so cute. It's delightful. Yeah. The current clan Fraser of Lovet emblem doesn't have that on it anymore. But I think the other clan Fraser still has strawberries on theirs that I did not know. Yeah. I'm not positive again. We're not credible<laugh> but isn't that funny? I don't know. So that's been occupying a lot of my brain space. It has, um, it's been a journey. It's been a journey, sorry. Seven times. Great grandpa. I didn't know father forgive me for, I know not what I have done.<laugh> to be clear that specifically is not your dopamine trampoline, the like whole genealogy, the whole genealogy journey. Yeah. Okay. And, and it's like dopamine trampoline with some spicy, not as fun dopamine. Right. But it's definitely been giving me dopamine. Mm-hmm<affirmative> it's been getting those receptors flaring. Yeah. For better or worse. That's been a big fixation for me lately. It sucks you in, it really does. Really does. Speaking of sucking you in, do you want to go make some smoothies? Yeah. And suck those down a strong absolutely sweet abso loo. Sweet. All right. This has been whole, whoa. That's not a, this has been whole, okay. Sorry. This has been or park core from wholehearted production company. You can find us on Spotify, apple podcast, Stitcher, you know, places where you can find podcasts special. Thanks to Keisha burrito for our wonderful cover art design. You can find her at paddle hall. That's P E T a L H O P on Instagram, Twitter, and Etsy. Big, thanks to Tom Rosenthal for our theme song, there is a dark place off of the album. Keep a private room behind the shop. You can follow us on the social needs at, or learn per core on Twitter at we are WPC on Instagram and on our very fancy little website. We are wpc.com. Yeah, you can find links to all that good stuff, as well as sources and transcripts in our episode description. If you enjoy this podcast and wanna hear more now right now is the time now to click whole the button.<laugh> sorry. We were yelling. So just whole cool. Now is the time for whole whole, okay. Sorry. Okay. Don't you? I normally say like follow subscribe here, but I understand if you don't wanna do that at this point. Um, why? Cause I have been yelling whole. Yeah. Okay. Um, if you hear us shouting whole and think boy, how do would I like to shout for some whole and wanna start your own podcast? There's a link in our episode description too. Our buzz sprout affiliate link. If you start any paid plan with them, you get a deal. We get a bit of money back, helps us keep our cute little disco lights on and also we'll love your forever. Yeah. Plus if you are gonna go through the process of making a podcast, just so you can scream whole, I would like to hear it personally. I think it'd be really funny. And I think there's something there. The level of commitment that requires would be astounding to the whole. Yeah. Do it before we get there. That's a challenge. Get on it. Mm-hmm<affirmative> get in it. Something else you could get into is, uh, sharing the show, get into some conversations, get into some connections with other people, whether they have ADHD or not. You can tell'em about this podcast. And if you also have money, you can give us money. We have a COFI it's uh, in our link tree on our Twitter and Instagram and website. Tell you what audience you listen to the show and you think to yourself, boy, howdy. This has inspired me either. I have ADHD and there's somebody that I want to relationship. Or there is somebody with ADHD that I would like to relationship. We will make a little cut of this show that just says whole, whole, whole, whole, that you can send to your beloved works like a charm. I'm Jordan and I'm legs. This has been a disaster. See you two weeks.Speaker 3: